Reading Time: 9 minutes
Assistant Vice President Citi
When she was growing up in Bogotá, Annie Rojas was fascinated by the night sky and its many wonders. As a teenager, she gave up on her long-time dream of becoming an astronaut and chose a career in finance. Pragmatic but ambitious, she figured that if international business wouldn’t send her to the moon, it could at least take her to the other side of the world.
Annie’s story could serve as an advertisement for international mobility. Moving to Nantes in 2011 to join the Audencia IMM programme, she learnt to speak French, made lifelong friends, and got her foot into Citi’s door where she is leading a successful career in supply chain finance.
When an opportunity to transfer to the Dublin office presented itself, she didn’t know much about “the Emerald Isle” beyond its widely celebrated St Patrick’s traditions, but she leapt at the chance. There, she further expanded her worldview across a broader set of trade methods, gained exposure to a new working culture, met her soon to be husband, and developed a liking for one of the most revered Irish institutions: the pub.
Not everyone is tempted to move halfway across the globe and start life again in a foreign country with all the personal and emotional stresses this entails. But it certainly was a decision that paid off for Annie.
Not everyone is tempted to move halfway across the globe and start life again in a foreign country with all the personal and emotional stresses this entails. But it certainly was a decision that paid off for Annie.
Let’s meet the international executive who tells us about her journey and why her granny-style trolley, her swimsuit and a healthy dose of adventurous spirit are some of its special features.
Did you grow up in a traditional or liberal family?
I was born and raised in a close-knit family in Bogotá, the capital of Colombia. My two younger brothers and I were inseparable. My father has a degree in business and worked for Volkswagen pretty much all his life; my mother is a psychologist. My parents have always been proud of their Colombian roots but they also wanted us to develop an open-minded attitude. They often referred to our family members who moved to the US as inspirational. They enrolled us in a bilingual school knowing that speaking English would open doors to their children.
What sort of child were you?
I was quite shy and did not hang out with the cool kids. My boyfriend insists that I’m still uncool (laugh)… but I am definitely more open these days. The experiences I had abroad that forced me to throw myself into the unknown have helped shake off the shyness. I still have a tendency to get nervous. I got nervous ahead of this interview actually! But it’s getting better with time.
I think I performed well at school I because my parents had paid for our private education and I felt I had to honour their investment. For some reason, they thought that no proper education would be complete without years of swimming lessons, so I clocked up more laps in the pool than I can count.
What were your dreams back then?
I was fascinated by outer space. I watched tons of space movies, and after a visit to the NASA centre in Florida I even wanted to become an astronaut. I gave up that dream when I was a teenager, but with hindsight, I realise that I still ended up choosing a path that led to far away adventures. This is how, at 16, I ended up on a bachelor programme in finance and international business at Bogotá University.
Living in France was another dream of mine. I loved the language and everything else I discovered about the culture through the many French movies I watched. I fantasised about becoming the “Colombian Amélie” and retracing her steps through the winding alleys of Montmartre. At uni, I met some exchange students from Audencia. I was impressed that they all had exciting international profiles already. They sold Audencia and the city of Nantes to me and I enrolled in Audencia’s international master in management (MSc IM) programme.
Was your experience of Audencia as life changing as you had anticipated?
It was! Until then, I had only left the country to visit my family in the US, so this was my first time in Europe. At 20, it was also my first solo trip and first steps away from my family. That was 10 years ago, and I have been living abroad ever since. Overcoming the language barrier was more challenging than I had predicted. I’d studied French for 4 years at university and thought I’d do OK until the day I found myself in the Nantes airport shuttle, praying I would find my way to the “Commerce” station… I stuck close to the driver until he promised me that I had made it to the right place. That was quite a stressful jump in at the deep end.
In a single year at Audencia, my classmates – many of whom I still count as close friends, and I built so many memories. We travelled to Barcelona to visit a partner school, and a few of us celebrated New Year in Switzerland. The opportunity to continue onto a yearlong internship was also immensely valuable. In Colombia, when young graduates leave university, they feel much more vulnerable without this prior work experience.
How easy was it adapting to French culture?
What really helped was living with a French family. We would have long dinners together and they introduced me to the local cuisine (ah! Le plateau de fromages!), and many other traditions. They moved house while I was there (and I went with them!), and they put up little signs with the family members’ names on the doors of each bedroom. I will never forget seeing mine was marked “La Chambre d’Annie”. They told me they kept the sign up a long time after I moved away, which I found so touching. To this day, I call them my “French mum and dad”.
The main cultural difference I had to adapt to was around friendship. For the first few months, when I engaged in a conversation I naturally expected the person to be my friend or at least be willing to build a friendship. Sometimes I would bump into people the following day and they would not remember me, a reaction which takes some getting used to! Then, when I started to experience the office culture, I understood that the French tend to keep their work and personal relationships separate. It gets better when you accept that and don’t take it personally. French people are more private than Colombians are and some need time to warm up to new acquaintances. On the plus side, once you have formed strong bonds with someone, they will treat you like family.
How did you climb the steps at Citi?
For me it’s always been about seizing opportunities as they present themselves. As the expiry date on my student visa got closer, I tried to remain philosophical about the dozens and dozens of internship applications and rejections. I set myself a deadline and decided that if I hadn’t secured an internship two weeks beforehand, I would pack up and go travelling. On the day I was getting ready to pack my suitcase, my luck turned and I received an offer from Citi.
In 2011, I joined one of the bank’s branches in Paris, close to the Champs Elysées for a one-year internship that was later converted into a permanent role. I started in the trade and treasury solutions department, and my job involved going through export documentation and finding financial solutions for exporting from France. After being promoted to trade sales associate, I got to work with a broader selection of products such as supply finances, letters of credit and guarantees. My clients were using our services to ensure that the risk associated with the transactions in terms of documentation and payment was covered for both parties. Suppliers and buyers relied on me to make their interactions easier. My job was client-oriented from the start, and my manager, a great mentor, encouraged me to learn on the job.
Did you go on an Amélie pilgrimage to Montmartre when you arrived in Paris?
You may laugh but this is exactly what I did on my very first day! When I lived in Paris, I spent so much time in this quaint neighbourhood. As I said, I love swimming as it has a sort of meditative effect on me, so another way I spent my free time was to try out as many swimming pools as I could find… and there are lots! I was on a sort of mission, or “swimming pool crawl” (laugh). My top pick is the Molitor; I love its avant-garde atmosphere.
Why did you decide to move to Dublin?
In 2014, employees with a bit of trade experience and language skills were encouraged to apply for a position that had opened there. It was a promotion and, with Dublin being on of Citi’s biggest European hubs, it would give me exposure. Frankly, after only three years in France, it had not crossed my mind to relocate, but the opportunity was too good to miss. I accepted the offer without having ever set a foot in Ireland. I didn’t know a soul there, and the only taste for the Irish life I had was through the fun and colourful tales of former Irish colleagues. I packed my suitcase and went!
What does your current role entail?
My remit grew when I took charge of all European clients and started to control a larger scope of products. I am now Assistant Vice President, or AVP, and I work with another area of trade, which is supply chain finance. I engage with my clients’ suppliers who want to participate in our programme. It helps them receive early payment and improve their cash flow. Recently I have also started managing our documentation team who helps with onboarding clients. It’s a team of 8, based in India, with a varied skillset. Some of them have been in supply finance for longer than I have and it has been a rewarding experience so far.
What makes it exciting to work in your sector?
It’s a dynamic sector with ever-changing legislation so trying to keep up makes it an exciting challenge. It suits people who get a kick out of working in a multicultural environment and across different time zones. It also feels good to know that my work leads to practical applications for end users as we enable the trade of thousands of everyday goods.
What are your predictions for the global supply chain?
Clients ask me this question a lot and it’s a tough one! I think that following the pandemic, trade will move from a crisis mode to a more normal mode of operating. 2022 was the year when we learnt some lessons from the chaos we faced, and we will accept that some processes will never return to the pre-pandemic times. Still, silver linings such as the possibility of working from home emerged in the aftermath of the pandemic.
What is the corporate culture like in Dublin? Do people still hit the pub at 5pm every day?
Not every day… but most days! In Paris, social interactions between colleagues amounted to the occasional “after work apéro en terrasse”. In Dublin, workers routinely finish their day in the pub. The camaraderie of the Irish workplace makes it easier to make friends and pubs help this, mixing people of all generations and backgrounds, finding it an easy way to share their life stories over a pint… or two.
What is it like being a Colombian in Dublin?
There aren’t many Colombians here. Until recently, we didn’t have access to an embassy, but only a consulate that we could reach once a year. The European media mainly tends to portray Colombia through the lens of its criminality issues and sadly, negative stereotypes still persist and can be exhausting to address. However, references that are more positive are now emerging. People’s curiosity about my country can be amusing: I was once asked if I was related to Gloria from the Modern Family sitcom (I’m not), or how I cope with the weather in Ireland, even though Bogotá is in the coldest and rainiest region of Colombia, so getting used to Dublin’s meteorological conditions hasn’t been at all hard. In any case, as the saying goes here: “the weather here might be cold, but the people are warm”. I have always felt truly welcome here.
Do you feel settled in Dublin now?
It’s interesting that I have never felt so Colombian since living abroad. After 8 years in Ireland, this is home. I applied for and obtained Irish citizenship as a way of showing my gratitude for the opportunities that the country has given me. I also wanted to be able to participate in society and exercise my right to vote. Ireland has held various referendums lately, where citizens have expressed their wish for change on important societal issues such as divorce and abortion. It was inspiring to feel that I could contribute. It’s funny how life plays out: Ireland wasn’t on my radar until a few years ago, and now here I am, a proud Irish citizen! I hold dual citizenship because I will never forget my Colombian roots.
Can we please go back to your boyfriend claiming you are “uncool”?!
Well, he claims that I’m like someone in her seventies (laugh). I admit that I listen to classical music, I bake, I go for walks, I do my grocery shopping with a trolley like a granny. But I have adopted many local traditions, and popping down the pub for a good time is top of my list, so I can’t be that uncool! (laugh).
Any plans for the weekend?
Big plans! Tomorrow I’ll be flying to Colombia with my fiancé for Christmas. I haven’t been in over two years, and I am beyond excited despite the 20-hour flight. Christmas in my country is such a special time. Celebrations start from the 1st December! I am looking forward to some serious wedding planning talks and to watching the Encanto movie… multiple times!
Meeting my soon to be husband here in Ireland has also played a big part in settling in. He is Danish and works in digital advertising. You could say that we represent the two sectors that Ireland is a renowned hub for: finance and tech. My dad is taking English lessons so that’s definitely a sign that he and my mother have come to terms with the fact that I’m not relocating to Colombia any time soon. I imagine that at some point we might move home – to Denmark or Colombia – unless we head to somewhere new that is neutral to both of us. I love the idea that our options are open.
Reading Time: 9 minutes
Consultant & e-commerce entrepreneur
After studying for her bachelor in The Netherlands with periods in Helsinki and Paris, before joining the International Master programme which took her to Nantes, Warsaw and Barcelona, Shirley declared she would never go back to live in her home town of Rotterdam in The Netherlands. At 23, with a bachelor and a master’s degree ticked off her to-do list, Shirley was not yet ready to enter the real world (her own words). With wanderlust still in her system, she bought a one-way ticket to Nepal and headed for Everest Basecamp on her own. “It was to do the scariest thing I ever did,” she says.
When she finally returned to lower altitudes, Shirley spent nine years in e-commerce, driving the brand XD Design with the iconic anti-theft Bobby backpack, running 8 successful kickstarter campaigns and leading projects with a hands-on crash test approach. Today Shirley has changed direction and, in the past year, she has become a consultant and e-commerce entrepreneur, purchasing her own products, having her own brands and selling them in Europe, on marketplaces and in her own web shops.
Shirley is insatiably curious and driven by a passion for people, nature, animals and things. She still has the mountain bug and has climbed some great peaks such as Mont Blanc in France, Toubkal in Morocco and Huayna Potosi in Bolivia. When we catch up with Shirley, it’s been 13 years since she graduated from Audencia and she is happily settled - in Rotterdam. Let’s discover which direction her career is taking her today.
Tell us about your childhood
I grew up in Rotterdam with my brother, mother and grandmother. As a child, I wouldn’t say I was shy but I was certainly a little afraid of the world. I would always be on the side-line. For instance If I went to an birthday party and everyone else was having fun playing outdoor survival games, I would be the kid in the corner crying and saying I was scared. I wasn’t sad, just shy. When I was about 16, I realised how fed up I was of watching everyone else live their life so I kind of pulled myself together and finally started doing things on my own!
Why did you choose to settle in Rotterdam?
After studying in Finland, France, Poland and Spain, I thought I’d never go back to The Netherlands and Rotterdam. I thought I was going to travel the world forever, but after so many years of living abroad, it really felt like it was time to come home and unpack my suitcases. Funnily enough, for the moment, I can’t see myself living anywhere else.
Where does your passion for mountains come from?
I’ve always loved being outdoors and climbing a mountain makes everything so relatable. When you reach your destination, there is an incredible feeling of victory and a sensation that you can take on the world. I went all the way to Everest Basecamp (5,364m) on my own, because even when you are alone, there is always a strong feeling of camaraderie in the mountains; everyone helps each other. You can be suffering from altitude sickness but the scenery is breathtaking and uplifting. I definitely learned about determination during my four months in the Himalayas in Nepal and Tibet.
How did you manage your return to the “real world”?
It was a big reality check. I realised I’d run out of money so work was the only option! The economic crisis was in full swing and companies weren’t hiring. I was told I was over-qualified and had too many diplomas; recruiters weren’t interested in me. Then I landed a great job at Trust, a huge electronics company here in The Netherlands where I worked as a purchaser for two and a half years. This meant a lot of traveling to China, negotiating prices and learning about the whole purchasing process. Then, when I wasn’t looking for it, a new opportunity came my way with the Dutch company XD Design. They had been selling mostly promotional gifts and wanted to grow the retail side of the business, selling to consumers instead of only doing giveaways.
I started working for XD’s almost non-existent retail department. I came in as a replacement to the one person who had set it up but was moving on. They gave me a desk and wished me luck. I ended up setting the whole retail network of agents and distributors in more than 50 countries. It was an old-school way of selling but an amazing learning curve. Then I tackled the e-commerce strategy, which ended up being bigger than anyone had anticipated with a web shop in 52 countries, three warehouses globally and marketplaces all over the world. Our famous kick-starter campaign really got us noticed; we had one prototype, one idea, one story, but we sold over $1 million in one month. That was pretty crazy. Today, XD Design is one of the biggest suppliers here in Europe.
Tell us about the anti-theft backpacks; was the Bobby your idea?
We have a very talented design studio in Shanghai and I worked closely with them. They were trying to solve the problems people encounter on public transport, especially in big cities like Shanghai or Paris. Everyone carries their backpack in front of them like a baby because they’re terrified of pickpockets. We heard stories about people in France and Italy whose bags were being cut open and the contents stolen. I came in on the later stage for the look and feel of the backpack, the colouring and some of the smaller details. The great thing about a kick-starter campaign is that we actually got to co-create our bag with the consumers. The bag was about 90% finished but we really needed the end users to tell us what they were missing or what they needed. We did polls on whether to have extra pockets or a different colour for example, people would reply and we just changed the design and manufacturing. Co-creating with consumers was one of my favourite parts of the process. The bag that you see today is actually third generation.
Calling the bags Bobby was my idea; I have to take credit for that one! It comes from the round helmets of the London police bobbies as our backpack has the same shape. It’s meant to remind you of safety and police officers!
I remember in the first years after the bag came out, whenever I saw one – in Japan, Switzerland, the USA, anywhere – I would go up to the owners and ask if I could take selfies with them.
I spent nine years at XD so it has been the biggest chunk of my professional career so far. In November 2021, I made the decision to leave the company.
You sound as though you were very happy at XD Design, what made you leave?
Yes I was happy there! If I were still at XD, I think that making the brand more of a household name would still be one of my goals.
However, I’ve always had the urge and the drive to be an entrepreneur. I think in some ways at XD, I was already an entrepreneur, it just wasn’t my own company. I built up my own team, developed my own products and did almost everything you do when you have your own company. But it wasn’t my own company and a little voice inside me had started saying “Shirley, if you don’t do it now, you never will”. So after nine years, I made the decision to quit, and I started two companies, one in consultancy and one in e-commerce.
Can you tell us more about your two companies?
One of my activities is consulting. I realised that whenever I went to tradeshows, other brands and entrepreneurs would ask me how to do a kick-starter campaign or how to set up an e-commerce landscape for example. So today, I advise other brands on e-commerce strategies, creating fully automated processes with multiple warehouses or multiple platforms, multiple websites, etc. I also develop marketplace strategies because that is still what some brands don’t fully understand or don’t get the full potential from. You cannot ignore the Amazons of this world, but how do you work with them without getting your prices cut or ruining your brand? Another big chunk is crowdfunding because a lot of brands are either afraid of doing it or really want to do it but don’t know how.
My other activity is my e-commerce business. I did purchasing and sales for so many years that it was quite natural for me to develop my own beauty brand and sell it on marketplaces and in my own web shops.
How did you identify the products to develop under your own brand?
Throughout my career, I’ve tended to go with the flow and see how things pan out. I love everything related to beauty – mainly products and gadgets – so I started my own beauty line. This morning I actually got an order from the USA, so by next week, there’s a store in New York that will be selling my beauty products!
My strategy is to look for gaps. I’m quite a geek and I love doing keyword searches. I try to identify what people are searching for and the gaps where the supply isn’t too high. I also need to have a positive vibe about the product and I won’t sell anything I don’t like or don’t understand. A product has to have a connection to something in my life. I for instance do a lot of dog products too, inspired by my own dog and her needs (I can see my dog staring at me as we chat).
How long will it be before you get the itch to do something else?
I’ve only had two real jobs since I graduated so it’s not as if I’m constantly changing. I think I’ll be good for a while now. For the moment, I’m happy to develop my two activities and I’m excited to see where they will take me. In The Netherlands, we say if a train comes along and you like it, just jump on it and see where it takes you. So that’s what I’ve been doing so far and I think that will be the same for my businesses. I really love what I’m doing it now and things are growing quite fast. However, I’m not saying that there won’t ever be a third or fourth company.
What are your best memories of Audencia?
Going to study in three different countries because the course I followed was taught in Nantes, Warsaw and Barcelona. In fact, I only spent one third of the MSc IM programme at Audencia. Altogether, it was an amazing 360° experience and I left with two lifelong best friends who I continue to see very regularly.
My experience in Dutch schools was quite impersonal, you just walk in, you do your classes, and you go home. That’s it. When I arrived at Audencia, it was completely different; there was a welcoming committee and an induction day, what a great start to the year. I think my first and last day are still very clear in my mind as they were so intense.
My classmates and I were all living in these small apartments in Nantes. Taghi and Nariman from Azerbaijan were my neighbours on one side and Cyril and Baptiste from France on the other. It was a tiny village of holiday homes with a very small swimming pool too. I remember it was just so much fun. One of my classmates had a car and although it was scary going round the roundabouts because he wasn’t used to driving on the right hand side of the road, we did some great road trips!
How do you let off steam?
I love pushing back the boundaries, being outside, travelling and climbing mountains. I love walking with my dog – she’s big, a cross between a boxer and a labrador and I take her for a 2-hour walk every day. Connecting with nature is something I enjoy as it revitalises me.
What advice would you have for students today?
One of my former bosses asked me to become a mentor for their start-ups and starting entrepreneurs. I recently participated in a women’s leadership session and one of the questions I was asked was how did I get to be so in control and so self-assured and confident about everything? My advice was stop worrying about being scared because everyone’s terrified underneath. You just get better at covering it up! Again, I would say just do whatever you’re terrified of. Those are the best things.
What are your plans for the weekend?
It’s going to be Kings Day so I’ll be going to this big festival. It’s great to get our social lives back after not seeing anyone for so long.
What’s your proudest achievement?
Definitely the fact that I’ve managed to do the things that I was always most afraid of. For instance, I was terrified of going abroad for the first time, but I went. Then I was terrified of coming to Nantes, having to discover a new city and meet another group of people I didn’t know. Nobody in my family had ever studied for a master’s degree so I was scared I wouldn’t succeed, but I did. Same for all the outdoor stuff. Same also throughout my career, managing to take the steps I was terrified of, doing the trade shows I was terrified of, and actually doing it all by myself. All this fear has taught me that the more terrifying something is, the better it will be in the end. I still get scared on a daily basis, but I’m proud that I manage to overcome my fears. It was the same when I left my good job and started my own company.
Reading Time: 11 minutes
Co-Head of Global Physical Trading at SOCAR
At 36, Taghi has moved up the professional ladder with remarkable speed. At 21, when he was head of logistics for a firm specialising in luxury goods and design, the only theoretical next step up was to take his CEO’s place. The two of them had a no-holds-barred discussion after which they agreed that with Taghi’s potential, the CEO would support him in aiming even higher. Taghi subsequently secured a prestigious scholarship with the State Oil Company of Azerbaijan and Total to study at Audencia. By 25, he had studied – and graduated – on 3 different continents.
Just a few months before his 30th birthday this young Azeri, born and raised in Baku, relocated to Geneva to work for the trading branch of SOCAR, the State Oil Company of Azerbaijan Republic.
“I had never planned to work in the oil and gas industry – I come from a family of doctors and academics – but when you grow up in Baku, there’s always a little bit of oil running through your veins.”
In March 2021, Taghi was promoted to Co-Head of Global Physical Trading at SOCAR, a role which gives him responsibility for trading 1 million barrels of crude oil per day while managing teams of traders in offices in Geneva, London, Singapore, Dubai and Houston. Although he clocks up gruellingly long hours, Taghi still makes time to satisfy an enduring passion for football (much more about that later) and run a youth charity club in Azerbaijan. We speak to Taghi during his precious holiday time, back home in Baku with his family. During our conversation, we learn more about his ambitions for a greener future for his children and discover that his lasting love of France even led him to co-found Baku’s first crêperie with a fellow Audencia alum!
Tell us about your family background
My father was (and still is) an academic -a mathematician- and my mother is a paediatrician. When my sister and I were growing up in Baku, the house was constantly full of my father’s colleagues from across the world all speaking different languages. The richness and diversity of his colleagues’ backgrounds and the pervading intercultural atmosphere shaped my childhood and made for some fascinating dinnertime conversations. My parents instilled strong values into their children and we grew up believing that we should always strive to be good people.
I didn’t really have any specific memories of what I was like as a child, but since the birth of my first daughter, some of them have certainly floated back up to the surface. My older daughter is now 5 years old and whenever she is cheeky or misbehaves, my mother reminds me that she gets it from me. I think on the whole though I was quite a well-behaved child, but you’ll have to check with my mother on that one as she may say that I was a bit hard to handle! I do remember being quite studious at some point though and finding school lessons interesting. I definitely developed a thirst for learning which has never left me.
What are your memories from when the Republic of Azerbaijan became independent in 1991?
I was only 6 years old when the Soviet Union fell apart and the transition towards independence took place. As a young boy in 1991, I have a distinct memory of being in our living room with my parents physically protecting my sister and me as the Soviet army drove their tanks past our front door and shots were fired. It was a time of uncertainty, of alternating bouts of fear and optimism with differing experiences depending on the generation you belonged to. As the country lurched from border crisis to financial crisis and back, the value chains fell apart and everything had to be re-organised from logistics to social services and more. For purely economic reasons, my father held down several jobs at the same time just to support the family. We all had the task of reinventing ourselves, but we got through it.
How did your time in the USA have an impact on you?
In my early school days, I spent 6 weeks in the US on a programme that was filled with visits to big cities including New York and Philadelphia. This first experience inspired me to apply for the Future Leaders Exchange (FLEX) programme, a competitive, merit-based scholarship programme funded by the US Department of State. Although its initial philosophy was to enable young people from ex-Soviet countries to learn about the US by spending a year in America with a host family and attending a US high school, the programme still continues today. After multiple rounds of testing and interviews, I left Baku – population several million, to arrive in Mason City Iowa – population less than 30,000.
Apart from the lack of diversity that I had always been accustomed to back home (no-one in Mason City spoke anything else but English or had much international experience), the biggest surprise was the independence of my teenage American peers. They all had weekend jobs, did community service, paid their way through university and left home as soon as they were able to support themselves. In Azerbaijan, you tend to focus on your studies, live with your parents until you are ready to get married and look after your family first and foremost. Discovering this different approach to life definitely made its mark on me and was a huge game changer.
Although my American host mom has sadly passed away, I still have close ties with my host dad who even made the journey to visit us in Geneva in 2018.
What were the highlights of your experience at Audencia?
To be honest, and I’m not just saying this to flatter the School, it was one of the best years of my life! I was lucky to have applied for and obtained a full scholarship from a joint venture between SOCAR and Total and I arrived in Nantes full of curiosity about France in general and Nantes in particular.
It was reassuring having a fellow student from Azerbaijan on the programme too. We got our accommodation sorted together, explored Nantes together and by the end of the first month, we went halves on the cost of buying a car: a 1-litre, 2-door Opel Corsa. It was tiny but boy did we enjoy driving it. As football fans, we managed to drive to some great matches as far afield as Madrid! That little car did us proud and I’m sure that quite a few of my Audencia classmates will remember squeezing into the back to go places!
The structure of the programme at Audencia was a wake-up call in more ways than one. Back in Azerbaijan, I was used to having classes in the morning and spending the afternoon working on assignments and coursework. At Audencia, we had to be in class by 08.30 and only finished by about 18.00, it took a while getting used to! However, I would still say that the biggest take home of my year at Audencia was the value of teamwork. It may sound corny but being in a class with 13 or 14 nationalities was a real test of how interconnected you are or can become. We worked together, had fun together and created lasting relationships.
Tell us more about the crêperie venture!
I think I must have tasted crêpes from all the crêperies in Nantes. I discovered them in Nantes and developed a serious passion for them. When we had to write a business plan for our International Business class at Audencia, my classmate Nariman and I wrote one for setting up a crêperie back home. A few years after we returned to Azerbaijan, we really did open a crêperie in Baku and it was a success! We had 4 people working for us and we were not only the proprietors but (very) regular customers. The venture lasted for nearly 4 years until I was posted to Switzerland and Nariman to Turkey, but we were able to sell it on as a viable business.
How would your crêperie associate and former classmate describe you?
I think he would say that I am a good and trustworthy friend. He might also say that I have a tendency to be a bit pushy, but I hope that he would add that it’s in a balanced way and not to the detriment of anyone else. I guess that people generally see me as determined and quite driven and ambitious. I have often quoted a saying that if you can’t run towards your goal, you walk to it, and if you can’t walk then you crawl and if you can’t crawl then you lie with your head in that direction.
I think you have an interesting story about how you met your wife. Can you share it with us?
My wife doesn’t like me telling the whole story, but here it is… I met her at work. When I returned from the US exchange programme, I worked for a while with the team that recruited the future cohorts of scholarship students and my wife was one of them. This was just a coincidence and I had no romantic thoughts at the time because she was still in high school and I was already working. We met a couple of years later, but again, we barely acknowledged one another. Then, one day at work, my boss introduced me to our new colleague who was starting in the legal department and it was her! Our paths had already crossed several times but it was only when we became colleagues that we started dating. She is a fantastic person and my best friend; she definitely keeps me grounded and sane and I know I can always go to her for advice.
So, is football really all that important to you?
Football is an integral part of my life and perhaps, like oil, runs in my veins! I have played it, supported it and helped organise football-related events wherever I have been in the world. Back in 2003, with some school friends, we set up the Baku Fire Football Club and joined the national futsal league. We’re almost at the 20-year anniversary landmark and although I no longer play there, I’m honorary president of the club and our young players are winning some great competitions. During my time in the US, I was in the high school football (soccer!) team and this got me noticed, leading to several offers from American universities to join them although it wasn’t something I’d ever anticipated doing. For me, sport is about letting off extra energy, the team spirit and pure enjoyment.
One of my fondest football memories while I was at Audencia was going to a Nantes-Lyon match at La Beaujoire which Nantes won 2-1. I can still remember parts of that match more than 10 years later! In Geneva, my job is demanding, but there is always time for football. What more can I say? Football follows me around. My daughters are already armchair football fans and I manage to play football with them whenever we have a moment at home. My older daughter joins me if I’m watching a game on the TV, most recently during the European Cup.
Being a trader, you must know what it’s like to work in a stressful environment. How do you manage stress?
Stress drains our life power and I realise that and try to approach it responsibly. I’m definitely not a stress junkie and it’s not something that I necessarily want to have as part of my daily working life. However, as you mentioned, the very nature of my role – trading – has a fairly stressful environment as part of the job description. You have to be ready to make the calls and accept responsibility for them. However, I always try to avoid stress levels that would affect my relationships with people. If I’m in a stressful situation, I try to do a helicopter view and stand back. I try to understand the moving parts and what has caused the stress and this helps me to calm down and deal with the situation better.
There’s a method I use from time to time when I go into an important meeting. I mentally box up anything stressful and make sure there’s time to deal with it after the meeting. This helps me to distance myself from the problem and free up the head space to deal with the meeting in real time. It works!
Your CEO is a woman; does she have a specific leadership style?
I’m glad you asked this question. Having grown up in a family where the women – my mother, aunts and grandmothers – have all without exception had successful careers, mainly in medicine and academia, it’s something that I haven’t ever questioned. Women got the vote in Azerbaijan over one hundred years ago – often before many European countries! My CEO, Mariam Almaszade, is one of the first women to run a large oil trading company and I’m definitely proud of that fact. She joined the company in 2018 when it was going through a turbulent period and is currently leading the company through the pandemic with some good decisions. She has the skills and personality to keep up with the dynamics of the energy trading environment, brings her fundamental previous experience to the table and has an analytical mind-set and a hands-on managerial approach.
What about your own leadership style?
I think my leadership style is based on what I learnt myself from my managers, parents and professors. For me, the keys are education, learning new skills and gathering knowledge and I always encourage my teams to have that conversation with me. I also enjoy delegating and preparing people to do the job better than I can! The value I put on the table is helping people to choose the right paths and making it consistent with their career goals. I also think I’m good at building teams. Due to the nature of our business, I tend to approach things with a P&L mind-set so I find I can see the advantages of hiring new team members and am able to convince my bosses that this is the best way forwards.
It is no secret that the oil and gas industry is a target for climate campaigners. How do you react to these attacks and how do you see yourself having a positive impact?
I fully understand, accept and agree with the constructive criticisms but I also want to be part of the industry move from brown to green. The earth’s resources are becoming increasingly scarce and although things are starting to move in the right direction, our use of oil and gas is going to continue a while longer until we have a viable and lasting alternative. However, we are all aware that things must change and it’s not because I work in the oil and gas industry that I can’t have an impact. In fact, I hope I can contribute by instilling some changes from within. Oil companies and individuals must invest as much as they can in making sure this sector reduces its ecological footprint. The world has to become greener if we are to leave a decent legacy for our children and it mustn’t just be a bit of superficial greenwashing.
I am very involved in Climate Neutral Commodity (CNC), an independent Swiss business-led initiative supporting the global commodity industry in its transition to carbon-neutrality. I am a member of the advisory board and we have developed a process to measure and verify the offset greenhouse gas (GHG) emissions from production to delivery, or to end-use (covering the full commodity lifecycle). This is part of the way we can ensure that the industry makes a positive change.
Where do you see yourself in 5 years?
I hope that in 5 years I will still be bringing value to the company and the next generation of employees. I still feel that I have a huge amount to share and achieve. I definitely want to be part of the move towards a greener and more sustainable industry. As my children grow up, and understand my line of work, I hope they will, one day, be proud of the positive impact I have had. I definitely want to be able to look my daughters in the eye and tell them that I am striving for a greener planet. I also hope that in 5 years I will continue to maintain the work-life balance I enjoy today and still have time for extracurricular activities such as my work with the youth charity club back home in Baku.
What are you planning to do during your holiday?
Visit some of the many beautiful places in Azerbaijan and see our families!
Very unusually for a comparatively small country, Azerbaijan has nine different climate zones from semi-desert and dry steppe to alpine tundra and more in between. Each time we come back, my wife and I try to show our daughters as many different aspects of our home country as possible. We also spend time with parents and grand-parents to give the girls as much family time and cultural exposure as possible, and there’s a language aspect too. Our 5-year old is growing up in Geneva and her French is way better that her parents’. She sometimes even apologises for us when she thinks we don’t understand. In turn, we make sure she and her sister are exposed to as many different Azeri speakers as possible.
Reading Time: 10 minutes
CEO & MD AT PRINCE BANK
Like all Cambodian boys, Sorachna Honn has been raised to respect his elders and his teachers, to work hard and with integrity, to provide for his family and to remain humble and compassionate. At the age of 40, he still embodies the traditional Cambodian values which are steeped in age-old Buddhist traditions. What sets Sorachna apart and explains his success in setting up one of the best-performing banks in South-East Asia, is an additional set of qualities. Endowed with maturity and good observation skills, over the years he has developed a sense of curiosity for human behaviour and for the world, that has encouraged him to look beyond his own backyard.
In 2015, Sorachna set up a microfinance institution from scratch. Just three years later, it was awarded a commercial banking licence. It isn’t just the sheer speed of development that is impressive. The accumulation of international accolades is a testament to Sorachna’s belief in corporate citizenship. These include “Asia’s Top 100 Best Employer Brands for 2019” by the Employer Branding Institute, “Cambodia’s Best Employer Brand for 2020” by World HRD Congress, and “Cambodia’s Best Commercial Bank 2020”, from International Banker. And for Sorachna, “there’s no stopping here”. His ambition is very much to play in the big league, with his sights set on the world stage.
In this interview, Sorachna recalls his journey and especially his fond memories of his time at Audencia. He explains how joining the IMM programme was pivotal in shaping his career...and in creating a lifelong aversion to sausages!
Were you brought up in accordance with traditional Cambodian values?
Very much so. My family is of Chinese descent and settled in Phnom Penh a few generations ago. That’s where I grew up. I am the eldest of three sons. My parents were not particularly wealthy and had to work long hours, so my grandma looked after me a lot. I was raised to be a respectful and obedient boy at home, and my family and neighbours often praised me for being kind and helpful.
I was born shortly after the end of the Pol Pot regime and its barbaric mission to decimate the country’s intellectuals. Despite the intimidation campaigns, my mother retained a deep admiration for the teaching profession throughout those traumatic years. She instilled in me this sense of respect, and for many years, I dreamt of becoming a teacher myself. My mother had high expectations when it came to my homework, and she was constantly encouraging me to pick up new skills. I have fond memories of those years though, as I loved school and studying. I suppose my education would be considered strict by today’s western standards, but I only feel gratitude towards my relatives and teachers for the way they nurtured me.
So, you were not the type of child who would lark around in the playground just to become popular?
Well, you had more chance of finding me on the sidelines, watching my friends play, rather than at the heart of the action… especially if I sensed that their games were going to get them into trouble! From a young age, I have been a keen observer of the people around me. That was my way of learning, and to this day, I have retained this interest in human behaviour.
I wasn’t a coward though. In fact, I have always been curious and independent, and I was happy to go to school on my own from the age of five. I was regarded as the most mature child in the group and I was elected as the school leader. So, I guess I must have been popular, …in my own way that is!
Why did you decide to go abroad to study for your master’s degree?
Whilst I was studying my bachelor’s in engineering in Phnom Penh, I started working as an English instructor. When I finished Uni in 2003, I worked for an insurance company, and then for an institution run by American experts providing financial technical skills. This is when I realised how strong the banking industry was getting in Cambodia, so I joined Canadia Bank, the largest local bank, as a loan officer. The turning point for me was when I realised that the work experience that I had accumulated was never going to allow me to progress far enough in the banking sector. Therefore, I decided to upgrade my financial and management knowledge, and enrolled at the Royal University of Law & Economics, which I knew had a partnership with Audencia. Once there, I studied really hard and I managed to fulfil my dream of joining the double degree programme to study in Nantes.
Tell us about your experience of adapting to the French way of life….
It was my first time in Europe and I had never been so excited. Luckily, there was a tight-knit Cambodian community in Nantes. One friend in particular took me under her wing and helped me find accommodation. For the first three months I stayed in a mobile home on a campsite near the school, and I loved it! I had mentally prepared myself for a culture shock, so I adapted quite well. I was determined to make the most of my stay and to open myself up to discovering as much as possible. I had already decided to try absolutely every new food that came my way. The most interesting culinary discoveries I made were couscous and kebabs. However, there is one French speciality where I had to draw the line… sausages! The mere recollection of tasting a sausage horrifies me!
What is your best memory of being a student on the IMM programme?
I was impressed at how the staff at Audencia made international students feel so welcome and helped us to integrate. The curriculum and resources were of a very high standard. I even brought back some HR and project management case studies in my suitcase: I still have them in my home office!
My class was a real melting pot with students from France, China, India, Vietnam, Canada and Morocco. There was a fantastic atmosphere in the group and we often went downtown for some drinks… even though I don’t drink much, so I went along mostly for the company. It is hard to single out my best memory but our international workshop in Poland was probably the highlight. I had my first snowball fight there, at 27 years old. In fact, it was the first time I had ever seen snow. This memory will stay with me forever.
What is the biggest impact this experience has had on you?
Prior to leaving, I regarded myself as a local Cambodian guy. During my time at Audencia, I spent a lot of time observing my fellow students, the teachers, and my Cambodian expat friends. I analysed their way of learning, working and socialising. In less than a year, my eyes opened wider, and I had some sort of awakening. I realised how big the world was – much bigger than I originally thought – and that being “just” Cambodian would not be enough. I promised myself that I would keep on challenging myself to always remain curious about what lies beyond my comfort zone. I often reflect on this time of my life, and I remind myself how lucky I was to have been on this journey.
Why did you decide to go back to Cambodia?
Whilst in Nantes, I have formed some strong bonds with lots of Cambodian friends and relatives who had emigrated there. I even got involved in a friend’s grocery business. Many grew fond of me and asked me to stay in France. They were trying to convince me that my future would be much brighter there than in my home country. They suggested possible ways to keep me from leaving, which I took as a compliment. But it had always been clear in my mind that I would eventually go back to Cambodia.
I was well known to senior managers at Canadia Bank, where I had been working previously, and I had kept in close contact with one manager in particular who promised me that upon my return, I would be able to find a suitable role within the company. Canadia was an established and reputable bank with a wide network across the country. As I sensed a shift in the global economy towards the East, I knew that going back to Canadia would be a strategic career move for me.
How did you come up the idea of setting up your own financial institution?
Upon my return from Nantes in 2008 and right up to 2013, I was assigned to be in charge of several Canadia branches, first in Phnom Penh, and later in more rural areas. That experience proved invaluable in giving me a first-hand view of the challenges faced by business owners, especially small and medium enterprises (SMEs). I became acutely aware of how the difficulty of accessing financial services was keeping so many SME owners in poverty. I was tempted by the idea of setting up an institution to tackle this issue. The person who is now my boss gave me a hint that he had the ambition to own a bank in the coming years, and that he wanted me to run it. It took me a while though, to gain the confidence that I was qualified enough to take on this responsibility. Being repeatedly recognised by my senior managers for my hard work, results and sense of integrity finally encouraged me to take the plunge, and in 2015 I set up Prince Finance Plc.
This is a very admirable and ambitious project! What was the biggest challenge you had to overcome?
Recruiting the right talent has always been my main priority. I have a vivid recollection of a particular day, right after I had made up my mind about launching my own venture. I was sitting alone in a coffee shop by my mum’s house, in Phnom Penh. I was scratching my head wondering how on earth I would manage to convince anyone to embark on this project with me. I got introduced to someone who was experienced in microfinance, and who believed in my vision. We struggled to get our first hires because many professionals with high qualifications in banking were wary of joining an organisation that was starting from scratch, and they thought that microfinance was too niche. So, we went for a broad and open recruitment strategy. For me, people’s technical ability mattered less than their attitude and commitment. I made it clear that the journey ahead would be hard, stressful and outside of everyone’s comfort zone, including mine. At the end of the first year, several senior position employees of the first batch had quit but we grew to become a team of 150. We reached 200 in the second year, and in 2018, we obtained a commercial licence for what became Prince Bank. Running a commercial bank requires specific knowledge and skills that I was aware I didn’t have. But my strength was that I could tap into my network and recruit highly qualified bankers.
Prince Bank differentiates itself through its commitment to social development. What form does it take and why is it important to you?
Small and Medium Enterprises are the main pillar of the Cambodian economy. To me, they are the key to raising the living standards of the whole nation. Our country has millions of people who are full of ambition and desperate to start their own business. So, we provide special loans, with low interest rates and a long-loan term, and we aim to support them on their journey with a spirit of “winning together”.
I place corporate social responsibility at the core of the company. Our company’s success goes hand in hand with our society’s welfare, so it is imperative that we give back to the communities in which we operate. Many of our CSR projects are linked to improving education in Cambodia because I believe that development starts from the ground up, with well-educated citizens.
Microfinance is an increasingly popular sector. What would be your advice to Audencia’s students who are thinking of working in this field?
Microfinance is a way of lifting individuals out of poverty by giving them access to microcredits for their own business. This strategy has been an integral part of Cambodia’s economic growth, and one of the biggest successes for financial inclusion worldwide. Some international financial organizations have recognised Cambodia as a role model for other developing countries, such as southeast Asia or South Africa. It is a fascinating discipline that evolves rapidly, so I would advise anyone interested to gain a great deal of expertise, much more specific than the expertise I acquired myself 5 or 6 years ago.
What is it that brings purpose and meaning to your everyday life?
I don’t own Prince Bank but I feel as committed to it as if it were mine. I consider that my mission is to fulfil the owners’ vision for the company. I just want “my” Prince Bank to be the leader in Cambodia and possibly in a few years’ time to expand beyond our borders. Hopefully, the world can one day benefit from my bank’s services. What drives me is to continuously empower my colleagues – at all positions, through high-quality training, so they can develop and do their job to the best of their abilities.
How do you cope with such a high-pressure job?
I am not going to lie; my journey hasn’t always been a walk in the park and I have endured many nights on very little sleep. What keeps me sane, is the reassurance that I have recruited talented individuals whom I can totally trust. But I fully accept that stress comes with my job, and I manage this by working out. Lately, I’ve picked up golf; undeniably a convenient way of combining exercise with networking.
Spending time with my children, who are 3,6, and 9, is also essential. I leave the house early and get home late, so I kiss them goodnight when they are already asleep, I often have work functions during the weekend, and I am reachable for work 24/7… So, time with them is definitely more about quality than quantity! They complain that they don’t see me enough; so, when I am with them, I try to be fully present. To make it up to them, I let them pick the games we play. I am fortunate to be married to a wonderful woman who endures most of the stress of our everyday family life!
What do you wish for your children’s future?
I just wish they are wise and smart enough to pick something for themselves. I hope they will find their own path the same way that I have found mine. I will certainly encourage them to try.
What are your plans for the weekend?
I am taking my family on a 3-day trip to Kampot, a coastal town in the Southwest of Cambodia. We will spend some relaxing time in nature, with my boss and his family. Even if it’s only for three days, I look forward to the kids giving me a break and not complaining that I work too much!