Reading Time: 11 minutes
CEO & Founder of Handiroad, serial entrepreneur
Stéphanie’s path to date has been one of ups and downs. She was diagnosed with a rare neurodegenerative disease and Asperger’s syndrome and her family struggled to accept her differences. At her lowest point, Stéphanie was living in emergency housing and eating at foodbanks. However, despite her reduced mobility and hearing impairment, in 2009, this single mother of 3 set up her consulting firm and went on to build a successful career in international strategy. 4 years ago, Stéphanie launched the Handiroad app and in 2019, Exportunity, with both initiatives earning her awards and recognition as an international incubator and growth specialist. She is dedicated to strengthening the legislation on disability and the French government seeks out her expertise on a regular basis.
In overcoming the harshest difficulties, Stéphanie has developed a rare ability to turn kicks in the teeth into a strength that puts her back on her feet and propels her forward with an even stronger eagerness to fight. Years of being ignored and rejected have made her resilient and innovative. However, her most admirable quality is perhaps the positive energy and sense of wonderment she exudes. Stéphanie never loses an opportunity to stress how lucky she feels and her story is a lesson in gratitude. Although she faces the day-to-day realities of ill health and the prospect of physical decline a short way ahead, Stéphanie is aware of how precious life is and the power of mind over body.
Stéphanie thanked us for showing interest in her journey and for allowing her to speak safely. After years of suffering herself, Stéphanie’s purpose is to help those in difficulty who are still too shy or ashamed to open up. “It is thanks to initiatives like the ‘Iconic Alumni portraits’ that people like me can find the energy and the motivation to move forward.”
Where do you come from?
I was lucky to grow up in the 15th arrondissement in Paris, a place where culture was accessible and visible on every street. The UNESCO headquarters, an organisation that I have always admired, was just around the corner from my home.
What were the values your parents shared with you?
Frankly, they were too busy with their jobs to be overly preoccupied by our moral upbringing. There was an expectation for my two brothers and me to be independent and just get on with it. From a very young age, we went round with the door keys around our necks. My mother drew architectural plans and was always snowed under with work. My father was an architect.
You are a super-connected serial entrepreneur. Have you always been an extrovert?
Quite the opposite! Although as a girl my hearing loss was still mild, I was permanently anxious that I would misunderstand others, so I struggled to form bonds. I felt so different from everyone else that I preferred to stay in my bubble where I was less exposed. It was only in my thirties, after being diagnosed with Asperger’s, that I understood my behaviour better.
What were your coping mechanisms?
I struggled to relate to children around me and was much more comfortable communicating with people outside my family circle. I got on well with elderly and vulnerable people and wanting to understand their differences helped me to overcome my shyness. In addition, when I was about 10 or 11, I asked my parents for a subscription to the UNESCO Courier and Le Monde Diplomatique. These publications threw the realm of possibilities wide open for me with a range of exciting and culturally diverse stories.
Can you share the details of your disability?
I suffer from a neurodegenerative disease that affects the girls and women in my family. It affects my spine, ear canals, bones and cartilage. I have difficulties breathing and will have to undergo a series of operations to have my face reconstructed. I’m not sure yet what the new one will look like but it doesn’t matter! Luckily, my hearing only deteriorated gradually so my brain had time to memorise sounds. My voice is quite normal, although I don’t always realise when I’m shouting… fortunately my kids are there to let me know!
Luckily, once again, my high functioning Asperger’s syndrome has given me fast cognitive skills. My brain uses context and visual clues to help me fill in the gaps when I can’t hear. Interestingly, some of my disabilities compensate for the others.
How did you talk about disability in your family?
Disability was a totally taboo subject and no one ever mentioned it. My mother was ashamed of her hearing aids and kept them hidden from view and my aunt, who underwent 37 operations on her spine, was considered an embarrassment to our family. My grandparents hid her when they had guests.
At the time, we didn’t know that the disease was hereditary, so my parents didn’t connect my problems with the ones other members of the family had… or perhaps they didn’t want to. As a child, I felt incapable of transgressing this code of silence, so I bottled up my pain, my bouts of paralysis and my anxiety.
When did you get a proper diagnosis?
When I was 30, I asked my wheelchair-bound aunt to take me to the specialist who was treating her. The specialist told me very bluntly there was nothing he could do to stop the disease progressing. “You will end up like your aunt”, he said. That was a tough blow, but I must admit that since then, the dozens of other consultants I met have been helpful and empathetic. Some have even ended up crying in despair over my situation and prospects.
The disease generates lots of physical and emotional pain. I have never been ashamed of my hearing issues but it often bugs me to think that I waste people’s time when they have to repeat themselves. However, my decreasing motor abilities have sent me on a complicated journey of acceptation and renunciation. I used to dance and play squash, both of which I have had to give up. When you start losing your autonomy, it is not so much your pride but your sense of dignity that takes a hit.
What gave you this international focus?
My grandmother’s husband worked for Air France so I guess she could have travelled the world for free. Yet she never left her house for fear of access issues. I grew up surrounded by disabled people who refused to imagine the possibility of joy. I know that one day I will be paralysed and, like many of the women in my family, I may spend my last years in bed staring at the ceiling. However, I have consciously decided that I will discover the world while I still can, and make the most of my valid years.
What aspirations did you have when you were studying at Audencia? Did you write off certain careers because of your disability?
When I joined Audencia, I was two years younger than my peers and I firmly believed that the world was my oyster. I already had a clear objective of working in international strategy. Audencia turned out to be the ideal school to fulfil my thirst for knowledge and international dreams.
Socially however, I tried but never really managed to acquire the social codes, so I didn’t blend in and that was hard. I didn’t need a wheelchair back then, but I discreetly leaned on tables when my legs felt weak. My hearing was getting worse and there were gaps in my notes, but I never plucked up the courage to ask teachers and students to repeat themselves. I was a mute observer, stuck in a bubble. My inability to open up about my issues exacerbated my isolation. I still vividly remember one of the most traumatic days of those years. As always, I was sitting in the first row and intensely staring at the teacher so I could lip read. He must have confused my attitude with insolence, and in front of everyone, he asked me to stop. I felt exposed and ashamed but it was very much my own fault for not speaking out.
What was the turning point when you came out of your shell?
I had signed up to meet with recruiters at one of the fairs organised by the school and, thinking how important it was to be transparent with a potential employer, for once, I found the courage to talk about my disabilities. The feedback was bitingly dismissive: “You are young, you want to work in the male-dominated sector of strategy and you are aiming for international positions; how can you achieve this when you have trouble moving about and you struggle to understand people?! Unless you change your career plan, I can promise you 25 years of unemployment.” This was a huge slap in the face but also a powerful motivation to do something about my situation. I cried my eyes out until I realised that I hadn’t come all this way for nothing. I was determined to be even more convincing and gather more skills and knowledge.
Don’t get me wrong, there are still evenings when I cry after a physically and emotionally draining day. But the idea of rising up and giving things my best shot keep me going. I can’t afford to waste time standing still.
Did the first steps of your international career stand up to your expectations?
I had a blast! When I was just 21, the British IT company I was working for sent me to the CES in Las Vegas, the Mecca for tech. I had never done any public speaking, not even at school, and here I was on stage, facing 600 attendees. When I realised that none of them knew anything about me, I felt totally at ease, liberated and exhilarated. I soon took on more responsibilities and regions to manage. My role consisted in helping large foreign corporations penetrate and grow in the French market. My added value was to accompany them with intercultural management, helping their global teams to identify subconscious bias and work in better harmony. Fighting discriminations – whether against disabled workers, women in tech, or women founders, has been a red thread throughout my career. Sadly, 30 years on, we are still working through the same issues.
I later joined a large consulting firm, but there was no participative management, and the clients ended up leaving our strategy reports to die in a drawer. I realised I needed to put people at the centre of the strategy, and I launched my own international consulting company.
How did you handle the logistics of your business trips?
As much as I wanted this lifestyle to work for me, I ended up having to accept that travelling was physically and emotionally exhausting. Taxi drivers would drop me at the airport with my wheelchair and probably expected me to carry my suitcase between my teeth. When I attended professional fairs, I wasted a stupid amount of time trying to locate doors that I could open. Often, after a 6-hour trip, I would check into a certified wheelchair-accessible hotel, only to find myself stuck in front of a lift too narrow for my wheelchair. Frustratingly, there wasn’t a one-stop shop to help me with my planning needs.
Is this what led you to launch Handiroad?
Surprisingly, despite experiencing them first-hand, I didn’t realise straight away that I was bound to work on disability issues. The lightbulb moment actually came from my 5-year-old son, as he struggled to push my wheelchair across the pavement. It was physically challenging for him, he was fed up and he snapped: “Why don’t they make a Waze app for disabled people?”
I thought the idea was smart but I was a busy single working mum and I had already launched an incubator for startups interested in export. However, when I questioned my network, the feedback I received was overwhelmingly encouraging. The concept would serve my personal needs as well as those of the 25 million people facing mobility challenges in France from the disabled to the elderly but also parents with buggies for example… The Covid-19 lockdown period opened up people’s eyes about the stress induced by the lack of mobility. It affects our access to employment, health, entertainment… I realised that the concept was strategically innovative and that it would allow me to channel my passion for equality.
Can you pitch Handiroad for us?
It’s an app that makes moving about easier and safer for people with reduced mobility. In order to develop it at scale and in a cost-efficient way, I grew a community of users and I speculated on their kindness. Users help each other out by locating and warning about physical obstacles as well as aggressive behaviour they have been victims of. The four core values are kindness, equality, the power of sharing and joy. Joy is often underappreciated, yet it can be life transformative. I witness it every day, for example when grandparents can finally meet their grandchildren regularly.
“Universal Design” – a theory that aims for tools to be built by all and for all, is essential to my proposition. My consulting firm’s tagline was “make the world accessible to all”, which referred to the opportunity to expand to international markets. It also worked for Handiroad, so I kept it.
What gives you a sense of purpose?
I don’t sell glamour. I sell disability, suffering and stress. Yet I feel that by addressing these issues I can create hope. This is why I always jump at the opportunity whenever I am asked to speak in public. No one uttered a word at the last talk I gave but the following day I received 6,000 messages from people telling me they found me both inspiring and too intimidating to approach … the latter I find quite baffling!
From an external point of view, it seems that our society has become much more tolerant, especially in the workplace. What is your perspective?
Fortunately, the word disability is no longer taboo in the corporate world, even though we are still in an educational phase. Action is required now because I can assure you that there is still a lot of discrimination – enough to fill a book, or two!
When a disabled person is lucky enough to find a job, the role is often disheartening and ill adapted. I was once offered a telemarketing job selling mobile phone contracts – with my hearing impairment!
Moreover, the violence against us in the workplace is still real. Ten days ago, I was in a meeting with someone who wasn’t aware of my situation. I occasionally stand but as the meeting dragged on, someone in the room, who knew me, handed me a chair and explained to the guy: “She is disabled and it can be tough for her”. His reaction was “When you are a woman, and disabled, you don’t take on a job with responsibilities, you stay at home!” Comments like this can make you feel worthless but what was worse was the fact that no one else in the meeting spoke out. Sometimes these remarks are meant to be compliments “You know what? You’re actually quite smart!”
Being disabled and a woman is a double penance; in order to optimise my chances of raising funds, I have been advised on countless occasions to recruit a man as a business partner, “and if possible, a valid one”!
Four out of five women with disabilities are victims of violence in their daily life – whether physical, emotional, sexual, financial or professional. This injustice is close to my heart. So you see, dealing with other people’s attitudes is even more difficult than carrying the disease itself. I am lucky that I can now rely emotionally on a supportive network, but even then, it can get to you.
What would be your key messages to the Audencia community? How can we be better allies?
First, I want to encourage students who feel different to be brave enough to open up. You will be amazed how it will lift a weight from your shoulders, and how much more qualitative your conversations will become. On a practical level, I would like to make the teaching staff aware that with the multiplication of online events, subtitles are crucial. To alumni who are in hiring positions, I would say that when you receive a job application from someone with a disability, you should also see their potential for adaptability and innovation. When a new hire asks for specific modifications to their work environment and equipment, remember that they are not being fussy but that they have genuine needs.
People in HR should consider setting up inclusion workshops. I designed one for my clients where everyone is asked to work with a handicap for a day (blindfolded, with noise cancelling headphones, in a wheelchair…). This is a surprisingly cost-efficient way of creating awareness, promoting kindness and bringing a team together.
What is your proudest achievement?
This the sort of question that I never ask myself because I am eternally dissatisfied. Sometimes though, I look back and I realise I have done OK for myself in some areas. During lockdown, I entered an inclusion in tech competition with 114,000 female project founders from 180 countries. The first prize went to Microsoft and the second to me. I haven’t communicated about this prize, but it was such a powerful personal win. It brought me back to my childhood, when I was dreaming of the wonders of the world and believing that I would never be allowed to step in. I am proud to have designed a coherent itinerary and closed the loop.
Reading Time: 9 minutes
Programme Manager Flix
Esha grew up in a small Nepalese town on the eastern hills of the Himalayas. Her parents – who owned a bed and breakfast, were able and willing to offer her a private education. Esha is acutely aware of her privileged upbringing. In Nepal, private schooling is often the only way to access good standards of education, learn English, and develop the mind set required to forge a better life abroad. She insists that compared to many of her compatriots, she didn’t endure tremendous financial hardship. However, she did have to keep hammering away to get herself to where she is today.
As a child, she proved to have a sharp eye for how things operate and a natural interest towards optimisation and efficiency.
A natural problem solver, she has been lending a hand at her parents’ business for as long as she can remember. “I must point out that I got involved out of interest and never felt forced”. Her journey took her to west Bengal in India where she studied engineering, Bangalore for her first quality analyst job, then Nantes and Milan where she followed a master’s degree in Supply Chain and Purchasing Management at Audencia. She moved to Paris where she learnt her trade at Nissan’s European headquarters. She has recently settled in Berlin after joining Flix, a leading German company offering intercity bus services in Europe, North America and Brazil. Having developed a long-standing fascination for Germany’s legendary efficiency, this last move was also an opportunity for her to experience the system from within.
A board game collector, a goal planner, and a rational thinker who clearly likes all her ducks in a row, it would be easy to label Esha as a strategy geek. But a different side of her is unveiled when she shares her interest in self-development books and her spiritual quest for freedom. A sign that one can be curious about the ``what`` and the ``how`` in their worldly activity, whilst also questioning the ``why``.
Tell us about your childhood in Nepal. Did you spend it climbing mountains… or is this assumption a terrible cliché?!
It is a bit of a stereotype indeed…, not all Nepalese are sherpas (laugh)! The small town I grew up in is located on the foothills of the lower Himalayan range. With green hills on three sides, it is a land of enthralling natural beauty. But I was too busy studying and working to indulge in too many outdoorsy recreational activities, and I was more drawn towards arts and crafts activities.
My parents own a bed and breakfast. It’s a small family-run establishment that has always been buzzing with customers checking in and out, many of them pilgrims. From a young age, I was interested in the daily run of its operations and felt fully invested in it. I started by supporting my parents with basic logistics and assisting customers at the front desk. My analytical instincts kicked in early and at 15, I asked to have a look at the accounts to figure out how to optimise our processes.
Was education important for your parents?
It was paramount. My mother played an important role in impressing upon my older brother and I the importance of academic learning and financial independence. Where I come from, girls are not necessarily given equal rights to education. But my mum – a strong headed woman, made a point of treating my brother and I equally. My parents worked hard to give us both access to private schooling. I felt a responsibility to perform at school, but it wasn’t like a burden. I saw it as teamwork, where the whole objective was for our generation to become better off than our parents. So I typically woke up at 5am to study before going to school at 7am. I was back home at 3pm and when I finished my homework, I helped my parents with the family business. But it was not the ascetic childhood it might sound like. I was happy and having parents that encouraged to study was a privilege. Apart from a couple of rebellious years when I reached 15, I was a good kid.
Why did you leave Nepal?
The university provision in Nepal isn’t all that good and pupils whose parents can afford it go and study abroad. I left home at 18 to enrol in a university in India. Engineering felt like an obvious discipline choice because I had this thirst for problem solving. Academically, it was a big step up for me, so I had to work harder than I ever had. When you grow up with power cuts that last for the best part of a day, you develop resilience! This experience was also a mental challenge as I had never ventured far beyond my hometown. I was living in a student dorm in a country where I didn’t know anyone, and I felt homesick for months. I’m sure that having interacted with tourists from a young age helped me develop interpersonal skills and build confidence.
Tell us about your first steps in the professional world
Once I graduated, I got a job in Bangalore in the southern India, as a quality analyst for Sapient, an American company now part of Publicis. My role – at the crossroads between operations and technology, consisted in testing the quality of the software that we were building for different banks and hedge funds. I had always had my eyes on a master’s so after 3 years there I left. I realised that I wanted to know how supply chain and operations worked end to end, as opposed to specialising in one particular sector. In 2015, I applied for Audencia’s Master in Supply Chain and Purchasing Management. The dual degree programme in partnership with Politecnico di Milano made it particularly appealing.
Joining the programme in Nantes must have been another daunting step?
Moving countries at 18 had already made me feel like I had crossed a mountain so this intercontinental move was a little less overwhelming. Making new connections was not the most difficult part. No, it was… getting accustomed to the foreign cuisine. I mean… the uncooked sea food… and don’t get me started on snails! But hey, just like everything else, with an open mind and a dose of courage, you adapt. I loved the interactivity of the lessons, and the project-based group work. There was a bar by the river in Nantes, which became our hangout. By the time the whole class moved to Milan, we had become close, and we had so much fun. As for Italian food… for me it definitely beats French cuisine. No offense! (laugh). Our Whatsapp group is still alive and we have regular video chats. That felt particularly comforting during lockdown.
Tell us about your experience at Nissan’s European headquarters in Paris
I secured an internship in Paris and managed to convert it into a permanent job. It was exactly what I had hoped and more As a supply chain project officer, I gained both business acumen and tech skills. Later, I moved into a reporting role preparing analyses to improve sales decisions. This gave me valuable exposure to senior management. I enjoyed the corporate culture there. Its diversity and mixture of nationalities reminded me of the atmosphere at Audencia. It was a male-dominated environment, but female employees felt empowered. I certainly never felt that I was treated unequally.
Why did you move to Germany?
I had been there a few times to visit my brother who was living there at the time, and I had fallen in love with the country. I was fascinated by this sense that every system is efficiently run. I wanted to experience this way of living from the inside, as a daily user. And also my boyfriend – now husband – was living there.
How did you end up with a boyfriend in another country?
He is Nepalese; we went to the same school back in my hometown. He is just one year older than me and we have known each other for twenty years. Our paths crossed again in India when we both got scholarships to the same university. After he graduated, he moved to Mumbai to study a master’s in computer science. He is a pure tech guy. I moved to Bangalore then Nantes before we reunited for good in Germany. We survived the long-term long-distance relationship.
Flixbus has an inspiring vision of making sustainable travel both comfortable and affordable. What does your role there entail?
I made a conscious decision to join a smaller, agile company, where I could apply what I had learned at Nissan and gain more ownership and freedom. I have been at Flixbus for 6 months and I am really enjoying it so far. The company has a unique concept, combining tech and transportation and it has propelled the bus industry into the digital era. As a project manager and senior business analyst, my job is to optimise all the processes, products and tools that we launch for our operations teams and partners. Ultimately, I help to add growth for the company and improve mobility for our users. Flixbus has recently acquired Greyhound, which is the biggest and oldest bus company in the US and we have gone live in Brazil this month. It’s exciting to know that we are touching all continents.
I admire how the company lives and breathes its corporate values and first and foremost its attachment to sustainability. It is such a warm feeling at the end of a long day to know that you bring a positive contribution to the world.
What is the most gratifying aspect of your role?
I have the opportunity of making an impact and coming out proud, which is exactly what I always look for in a job. Through all this daily data crunching, reports writing, and project greenlighting, I am improving the customer experience of our passengers and co-workers. I launch systems that are used by a lot of people and are making their work and life easier. I can see myself staying with Flixbus for a while.
Does your inclination for tidiness and optimisation also transpire into your daily personal life?
I like to keep my home space and my finances neat and organised indeed. My personal “COVID lockdown project” was creating an Excel finance dashboard. I realise it’s not everybody’s idea of entertainment, but it gave me a sense of joy and accomplishment! I am also a planner when it comes to my personal goals: I write them down every year, come up with an action plan and a project list, and review them regularly. The end of year is a period of deep introspection for me. I am not particularly passionate or impulsive, so whenever I have an important choice, such as a career move, I always research thoroughly. However, once my mind is set on a goal, I am decisive and consciously dedicate all my energy towards it with the intention to come out as a winner.
Please tell me that you don’t spend all your free time on Excel?!
Ha, ha, no, far from it. I like to paint. And I collect board games. My current favourites are Azul, Patchwork and Ticket to ride. I also enjoy a good game of poker. Not surprisingly, I enjoy mostly strategy and planning games (laugh)! I am openly competitive, and I hate losing!
I am also an avid reader of personal development books. I am influenced by the wisdom of Eckhart Tolle, and the teachings of Joe Dispenza on our ability to free ourselves from limitations. I enjoyed “The Four Agreements” by Don Miguel Ruiz; it’s a “practical guide to freedom” that has stayed with me.
Your favourite activity in Berlin?
I enjoy strolling around in East Berlin, which is packed with historical landmarks. I am not an expert in the Second World War, but I can’t help but feeling moved by what I see. I also like the feel-good atmosphere of the Weissensee Lake, and the East Side Gallery: once the Berlin Wall and now the longest open-air gallery in the world.
Looking back … Do you think you have achieved success?
For me success is a process and I want my life to be a constant learning curve. I fear that If I ever consider myself successful, I will take my accomplishments for granted and see the curve slow down.
Your professional and life accomplishments must make your parents very proud of you
Yes, I think they are proud of me. And of my brother too – he has a PhD in strategic management and is doing a post doctorate at ETH Zurich. But it’s not my parents’ culture to express it to us very often. What they would say is that they feel at peace with the way they have raised me, and the place that I have secured for myself in the world. Even though they could safely retire and finally enjoy life, they can’t imagine a life without working. I haven’t seen them much since I left home. I last saw them for our wedding.
Where do you see yourself in 10 years’ time?
I hope that I will have grown. For me it’s not a question of promotion, job title or salary. It’s about self-development and my ability to constantly increase the scale of the impact that I am creating. This goal might lead me back to Nepal, where I can see myself as an entrepreneur. I would use my expertise in launching high quality operations projects and focus on accelerating the digital transformation of the country. Again, if I make that step, it will be a thoroughly researched and analysed decision!
Are you proud of your heritage?
Nepalese people are warm and welcoming. I am very fond of my country, and anyone who goes there will agree that its natural treasures are breathtaking. I just wish that people would look beyond the stereotypes. The mountains that surround us are superb and majestic but the topography makes life harsh for many Nepalese. However, I think we get our resilience from withstanding years of political instability and financial hardship.
Reading Time: 11 minutes
CFO Airbus for the Southern Cone
It is with an open smile and a lilting accent betraying her Southern France origins that Jessica Giuliani greets us for this interview.
Hers is a story of a youngster from Toulouse whose head was always turned upwards to the sky; such was her fascination for aeroplanes. Her mother was convinced that she would one day join Airbus, the city’s iconic multinational corporation. However, Jessica’s dream of becoming a pilot crash-landed when she was told -wrongly- that her eyesight would prevent her from flying. Smart, curious, and ever full of joie de vivre, she went on to graduate from Audencia’s Grande Ecole programme in 2013. At 33, her CV could make many fifty-year-olds pale with envy. In just a few years, Jessica has embraced a successful career in finance becoming CFO of Airbus in Santiago di Chile in 2020.
Armed with the confidence that 20/20 vision isn’t a prerequisite for flying, she signed up for her first lesson last year. The flying school is just a few minutes from her office, which she takes as a sign that the time has come to fulfil her life’s dream.
Thus summarised, Jessica’s trajectory seems almost predestined. When she signed her contract with Airbus, her mother said “See! I’ve always known you’d end up there. Didn’t I tell you so many times?” But Jessica insists on setting the record straight. It’s not about destiny so much as hard work, ambition and an appetite to jump on opportunities that has got her where she is today.
Thus summarised, Jessica’s trajectory seems almost predestined. When she signed her contract with Airbus, her mother said “See! I’ve always known you’d end up there. Didn’t I tell you so many times?” But Jessica insists on setting the record straight. It’s not about destiny so much as hard work, ambition and an appetite to jump on opportunities that has got her where she is today.
Let’s meet a fearless woman who has managed to get hold of what matters to her most in life, by keeping her feet on the ground and her head in the sky.
Tell us a little bit about your background. What steered you towards a career in finance?
Until 2007, when I came to Audencia, I lived in Toulouse. My parents are from quite a humble background; my father left school at 13, working as a mechanic before managing a Renault dealership. My mother was his secretary then joint manager. My parents’ lack of academic background had a significant impact on me because I grew up hearing the “You must get a good education!” mantra. They wanted me to be in a position to choose from a wide range of careers. Their dream was that one day I would join Airbus, which to them is the best firm in the world, offering opportunities, great working conditions, a career for life, and all this close to home in Toulouse!
What were you like as a child?
People always found me sociable and easy-going. I enjoyed interacting with adults and was excited when my parents had guests because I loved eavesdropping on grown-up conversations. I fed off the life experiences I was hearing and developed a certain maturity and curiosity.
What were your biggest wishes then?
I was desperate to travel the world. My parents didn’t have the time or the money for foreign holidays. But when I was 11, we went on a family trip to Reunion Island and that’s where I caught the travel bug. From the age of 13, I took it into my own hands to sign up for any holiday camp that we could afford.
My other big dream was to become an airline pilot. I was inspired by Hollywood movies, and I loved spending time in aviation museums. I always believed that a job as a pilot would be fulfilling on many levels: my inexplicable dream of flying, my fascination with engineering, the possibility to connect people, a thirst for reaching faraway lands and admiring landscapes from 40,000 feet above…
Were you serious about pursuing a career as a pilot?
I was totally determined. At the age of 12, I attended a career fair to figure out the best way to get there. I met with staff from the Air Force and from several French airlines. Several advisors spotted my glasses and told me that a flying career needed perfect vision. It turns out that they were wrong. I will never know would have happened had I investigated further. My mother always wanted me to work at Airbus; maybe she thought it would be the next best thing for me…
With such a stellar career in finance, is it safe to say you were a mathematical whizz kid?
I was a good all-rounder. My favourite subjects were maths and Spanish. I even helped my older sister to revise for her exams. Nevertheless, I also valued my social life and made time to go out and have fun. I would have liked to do some sport but my parents never had the time to sign me up and to take me to practices.
After her baccalaureate, my sister did a two-year course. She was my only role model, so I was naturally planning to follow a similar route. However, I met a career advisor in high school who, after looking at my grades, insisted that I needed to consider applying for preparatory classes, the two years that prepare you for the national competitive entrance exams to the best French business schools. I wasn’t even aware that the possibility even existed, as my parents didn’t have the academic codes to guide me through the system. I am so grateful to the lady who detected my potential and pushed me towards a different path.
What options did you choose at Audencia?
In my first year, I chose the sustainability track with specialised classes on sustainable economics and micro-credit, for example, and I dived into it with a passion. I chose finance as a major – to me, the most challenging choice but also one that would equip me with the skills that would be trickier to acquire later on the job. I did a one-year work placement with KPMG in Toulouse, during which I audited banks and industrial firms. It encouraged me to study a double major audit and corporate finance.
What were the highlights of your time at Audencia?
Throughout my first year, we worked on a project for an organic Mexican fair-trade coffee brand that aimed to export to Europe. I was by far the most enthusiastic member of my working group and I was the only one to speak Spanish fluently. So, I got to travel to Mexico for 2 weeks, visiting the cooperative, the trading port in Vera Cruz, and setting up all the costs. What an incredible experience when I think back about it!
I joined “Access Sud”, the micro-credit club. It was gratifying to be part of a community of students who were motivated by the same interests and values. The issues we were trying to tackle really awoke something in me. I must also mention the parties that were a great way to build up my social skills!
Did you ever feel self-conscious about your background?
When I first visited Audencia for the entrance exams, everyone I met was very friendly and I immediately felt at home. It felt a bit like landing in a fairytale world! My social background has never been an issue because I have always been comfortable and even proud of my roots. I know what my family values are and the hard work it takes to earn money when you don’t start out with much.
But yes, there were a few individuals who drew attention to what made me different. Some asserted that I would never get a job in Paris with my strong southern accent. When we attended the first Audencia party in Paris, others were shocked when I admitted that it was my first time in the capital. I just decided to leave the comments slide and to adopt a “we shall see” attitude. I knew that with resilience, I could build a path that would reveal my true personality, regardless of my background. These were isolated incidents and what I remember best is the school’s capacity to connect us with people from other horizons.
We noticed on your CV that you worked briefly as a flight attendant… tell us more, we’re intrigued!
I needed to earn some money during my last year at Audencia. Believe or not, I spotted the ad for an Air France flight attendant on the school’s job board. They need to fill these jobs every year, so I would encourage every student who fancies being paid to travel to check it out! I criss-crossed the globe and even got to sit in the cockpit during take-off and landing. Air France offered me a permanent position but I was wise enough to understand the value that an Audencia diploma represented. Besides, my true dream was to be in the pilot’s seat…
How did you land in Brazil, when you didn’t even speak the language?
After graduating, I did a 6-month contract in the internal audit department of Lagardere in Paris before returning to KPMG. Three years later, I realised that I didn’t want to stay in a company for a couple of weeks to simply assess the risks and deliver certifications. As a doer myself, I was itching to make an impact in a particular sector, be part of a team and implement a strategy.
From the age of 18, I dreamed of working in Latin America, especially after all the Spanish lessons I had during my preparatory classes. At 26, I decided it was time. The only paid job that I found was in Sao Paolo and I accepted a pay cut, but I figured that the opportunity was worth it. As LatAm financial controller for JC Decaux, I was in charge of branches in Brazil, Mexico and the Dominican Republic. 3 months after I joined, my boss resigned, so I quickly took on greater responsibilities… and learnt Portuguese! At first, I was talking “Portuñol” but after 3 months of lunchtime tuition and interacting with my flatmates, I experienced a sort of light bulb moment and I separated the two languages. It goes to show that with a good dose of determination, a foreign language isn’t a barrier to career progression.
What motivated your move to Chile?
In 2017, after deciding the corporate culture wasn’t me, I resigned and went travelling. My plan was to go backpack round Latin America for six months. Just a few weeks in, my manager from KPMG contacted me to say that there was an opportunity for me in Chile at NewRest, a catering company whose headquarters are in Toulouse. In between excursions, I logged in from various youth hostels and internet cafés in Colombia and Ecuador, and, after a long series of interviews, I got the job of Financial Director. I love how life can throw the best surprises at you. I wasn’t looking to move to Chile, and I wasn’t even looking for a job at the time… let alone this amazing opportunity for someone of my age!
I discovered the easy-going expat lifestyle, complete with company car, apartment and social connections. But I was working crazy hours as I had so much to learn and was managing 4 people in their 50’s who were not driven by the sort of motivation that I had taken for granted at KPMG. I stayed there for 3 years.
CFO at Airbus sounds like a huge step up. How did you manage to land such a senior role?
In June 2020, in the middle of a strict lockdown in Santiago, and the unsettling context of mass redundancy at the catering firm I was working at, I received a call from one of my ex-managers who encouraged me to apply for a CFO role at Airbus. If I have learnt one thing, it’s that it clearly helps to cultivate great relationships with your ex bosses! The Managing Director of the Chile branch was looking for someone based in Santiago to report to him as well as the LatAm CFO. The role entailed overseeing teams in Chile, Argentina and Uruguay as well as the client portfolio across the whole “ConSur”. The turnover was much larger than anything I had ever managed before. The challenges were exciting, having to negotiate contracts with governmental institutions and VIP clients.
I knew I would need broad shoulders, but reminded myself that I already had an experience in a senior role that I could leverage. So I decided to go for it and entered a 2 month-long recruitment process during which I had 5 interviews with 5 different people. During one of the interviews I had to deal with a few snarky comments, such as “We sell helicopters… not sure you know anything about those?!” Perhaps the interviewer was biased against my age, gender or the fact that I didn’t have any professional experience in aeronautics. But I didn’t let the questions stump me. I argued that in finance you don’t need to be have technical product expertise… but as it turned out, I happened to cultivate a passion for the sector, with a lifelong dream of becoming a pilot!
This seems to have done the trick and in 2020, I joined Airbus.
What’s a typical working day for you?
The tasks are too varied to fit into a daily template. Essentially, I try to prioritise making myself available for the team of 12 people that I manage. There’s a tendency to get wrapped up in Airbus meetings with my branch directors, my counterparts in other branches or colleagues from head office to discuss strategic projects such as regionalising the business which will result in moving functions to LatAm.
I have learnt to carve out time for myself to progress on my projects when I have realised that others’ priorities are not necessarily mine. Otherwise, I would be stuck in meetings until 6pm… and I confess that my vision is not to work until midnight!
Are you as organised in your personal life?
I wish! The day that I found myself stuck in Lima unable to pay for my hotel room or the bus because I had forgotten to activate my credit card … I realised how chaotically I can let my life run! Fortunately, the Peruvian friend of a friend generously lent me some money and saved my trip. I laugh now at the irony of how powerless a CFO feels with no access to a means of payment!
Which country would you recommend relocating to – Brazil or Chile?
I loved my time in Brazil because there I found everything that I imagined Latin American culture to be: music and dance everywhere, and the special warmth and joie de vivre of the people. In that respect, moving to Chile was a culture shock because I harboured the same expectations. In Santiago in particular, people are quite closed-off, far from the typical image of Latino. However, they are also the most loyal friends you could ever wish to have, once you have gained their trust. Here, when people invite you at their home, they introduce you to their family; that’s an honour. The attitude is closer to what we see in Europe… with the added benefit of an amazing living environment. It is safe enough that I can walk the streets at night. Being such a long country, it is a land of contrasts, with the Atakama in the North – the world’s most arid desert, a string of fjords and snow-capped volcanoes, and the glacier-carved lakes of Patagonia in the South. I have never seen anything like it. Chile gets my vote!
Have you given up on your flying dreams?
Never! My office is located on an aerodrome with a flying club. A year ago, I started taking flying lessons three times a week, from 7 to 10pm. I’ve been learning about aircraft aerodynamics and how the engine works. I’ve passed the theory, and I am now working on the practice. I have 22 hours of flying under my belt, and I need 40-60 hours to get my licence. So just a few more hours before I can fulfil my childhood dream!
I now realise that on commercial flights, you don’t actually pilot the plane that much. I get much more joy from flying in a small 2 person aircraft. You get to be responsible for all aspects of the flight. We don’t train on simulators, but we are thrown straight into a real cockpit. Last time my instructor simulated an emergency situation and turned off the engine to test my reaction. That was fun!
I always walk back on the tarmac with a huge smile on my face. I am proud that for the first time I have managed to be disciplined enough to carve out time for an activity that makes my life so fulfilling.
I am also fortunate, because even though it’s not going not going to help us win contracts, my boss encourages all employees to embrace their passion for aviation, in whatever form.
It sounds like you have achieved your main life goals already. What’s next for you?
This year will be decisive. I will either stay in a CFO role, possibly in another country. Or I might move on to an operational or sales role, which interest me as well. I confess that I would love to go travelling again… but I can’t be too greedy. For now, I am looking forward to getting my pilot licence and show my boyfriend, friends and family the stunning views of my adopted country, from above.
Stop press!
Since the time of writing, Jessica has indeed stretched her wings! She has her pilot’s licence and is now hoping to skydive -safely- into entrepreneurship. The Audencia community wishes her all the best and looks forward to seeing where she will fly to next.
Reading Time: 9 minutes
Assistant Vice President Citi
When she was growing up in Bogotá, Annie Rojas was fascinated by the night sky and its many wonders. As a teenager, she gave up on her long-time dream of becoming an astronaut and chose a career in finance. Pragmatic but ambitious, she figured that if international business wouldn’t send her to the moon, it could at least take her to the other side of the world.
Annie’s story could serve as an advertisement for international mobility. Moving to Nantes in 2011 to join the Audencia IMM programme, she learnt to speak French, made lifelong friends, and got her foot into Citi’s door where she is leading a successful career in supply chain finance.
When an opportunity to transfer to the Dublin office presented itself, she didn’t know much about “the Emerald Isle” beyond its widely celebrated St Patrick’s traditions, but she leapt at the chance. There, she further expanded her worldview across a broader set of trade methods, gained exposure to a new working culture, met her soon to be husband, and developed a liking for one of the most revered Irish institutions: the pub.
Not everyone is tempted to move halfway across the globe and start life again in a foreign country with all the personal and emotional stresses this entails. But it certainly was a decision that paid off for Annie.
Not everyone is tempted to move halfway across the globe and start life again in a foreign country with all the personal and emotional stresses this entails. But it certainly was a decision that paid off for Annie.
Let’s meet the international executive who tells us about her journey and why her granny-style trolley, her swimsuit and a healthy dose of adventurous spirit are some of its special features.
Did you grow up in a traditional or liberal family?
I was born and raised in a close-knit family in Bogotá, the capital of Colombia. My two younger brothers and I were inseparable. My father has a degree in business and worked for Volkswagen pretty much all his life; my mother is a psychologist. My parents have always been proud of their Colombian roots but they also wanted us to develop an open-minded attitude. They often referred to our family members who moved to the US as inspirational. They enrolled us in a bilingual school knowing that speaking English would open doors to their children.
What sort of child were you?
I was quite shy and did not hang out with the cool kids. My boyfriend insists that I’m still uncool (laugh)… but I am definitely more open these days. The experiences I had abroad that forced me to throw myself into the unknown have helped shake off the shyness. I still have a tendency to get nervous. I got nervous ahead of this interview actually! But it’s getting better with time.
I think I performed well at school I because my parents had paid for our private education and I felt I had to honour their investment. For some reason, they thought that no proper education would be complete without years of swimming lessons, so I clocked up more laps in the pool than I can count.
What were your dreams back then?
I was fascinated by outer space. I watched tons of space movies, and after a visit to the NASA centre in Florida I even wanted to become an astronaut. I gave up that dream when I was a teenager, but with hindsight, I realise that I still ended up choosing a path that led to far away adventures. This is how, at 16, I ended up on a bachelor programme in finance and international business at Bogotá University.
Living in France was another dream of mine. I loved the language and everything else I discovered about the culture through the many French movies I watched. I fantasised about becoming the “Colombian Amélie” and retracing her steps through the winding alleys of Montmartre. At uni, I met some exchange students from Audencia. I was impressed that they all had exciting international profiles already. They sold Audencia and the city of Nantes to me and I enrolled in Audencia’s international master in management (MSc IM) programme.
Was your experience of Audencia as life changing as you had anticipated?
It was! Until then, I had only left the country to visit my family in the US, so this was my first time in Europe. At 20, it was also my first solo trip and first steps away from my family. That was 10 years ago, and I have been living abroad ever since. Overcoming the language barrier was more challenging than I had predicted. I’d studied French for 4 years at university and thought I’d do OK until the day I found myself in the Nantes airport shuttle, praying I would find my way to the “Commerce” station… I stuck close to the driver until he promised me that I had made it to the right place. That was quite a stressful jump in at the deep end.
In a single year at Audencia, my classmates – many of whom I still count as close friends, and I built so many memories. We travelled to Barcelona to visit a partner school, and a few of us celebrated New Year in Switzerland. The opportunity to continue onto a yearlong internship was also immensely valuable. In Colombia, when young graduates leave university, they feel much more vulnerable without this prior work experience.
How easy was it adapting to French culture?
What really helped was living with a French family. We would have long dinners together and they introduced me to the local cuisine (ah! Le plateau de fromages!), and many other traditions. They moved house while I was there (and I went with them!), and they put up little signs with the family members’ names on the doors of each bedroom. I will never forget seeing mine was marked “La Chambre d’Annie”. They told me they kept the sign up a long time after I moved away, which I found so touching. To this day, I call them my “French mum and dad”.
The main cultural difference I had to adapt to was around friendship. For the first few months, when I engaged in a conversation I naturally expected the person to be my friend or at least be willing to build a friendship. Sometimes I would bump into people the following day and they would not remember me, a reaction which takes some getting used to! Then, when I started to experience the office culture, I understood that the French tend to keep their work and personal relationships separate. It gets better when you accept that and don’t take it personally. French people are more private than Colombians are and some need time to warm up to new acquaintances. On the plus side, once you have formed strong bonds with someone, they will treat you like family.
How did you climb the steps at Citi?
For me it’s always been about seizing opportunities as they present themselves. As the expiry date on my student visa got closer, I tried to remain philosophical about the dozens and dozens of internship applications and rejections. I set myself a deadline and decided that if I hadn’t secured an internship two weeks beforehand, I would pack up and go travelling. On the day I was getting ready to pack my suitcase, my luck turned and I received an offer from Citi.
In 2011, I joined one of the bank’s branches in Paris, close to the Champs Elysées for a one-year internship that was later converted into a permanent role. I started in the trade and treasury solutions department, and my job involved going through export documentation and finding financial solutions for exporting from France. After being promoted to trade sales associate, I got to work with a broader selection of products such as supply finances, letters of credit and guarantees. My clients were using our services to ensure that the risk associated with the transactions in terms of documentation and payment was covered for both parties. Suppliers and buyers relied on me to make their interactions easier. My job was client-oriented from the start, and my manager, a great mentor, encouraged me to learn on the job.
Did you go on an Amélie pilgrimage to Montmartre when you arrived in Paris?
You may laugh but this is exactly what I did on my very first day! When I lived in Paris, I spent so much time in this quaint neighbourhood. As I said, I love swimming as it has a sort of meditative effect on me, so another way I spent my free time was to try out as many swimming pools as I could find… and there are lots! I was on a sort of mission, or “swimming pool crawl” (laugh). My top pick is the Molitor; I love its avant-garde atmosphere.
Why did you decide to move to Dublin?
In 2014, employees with a bit of trade experience and language skills were encouraged to apply for a position that had opened there. It was a promotion and, with Dublin being on of Citi’s biggest European hubs, it would give me exposure. Frankly, after only three years in France, it had not crossed my mind to relocate, but the opportunity was too good to miss. I accepted the offer without having ever set a foot in Ireland. I didn’t know a soul there, and the only taste for the Irish life I had was through the fun and colourful tales of former Irish colleagues. I packed my suitcase and went!
What does your current role entail?
My remit grew when I took charge of all European clients and started to control a larger scope of products. I am now Assistant Vice President, or AVP, and I work with another area of trade, which is supply chain finance. I engage with my clients’ suppliers who want to participate in our programme. It helps them receive early payment and improve their cash flow. Recently I have also started managing our documentation team who helps with onboarding clients. It’s a team of 8, based in India, with a varied skillset. Some of them have been in supply finance for longer than I have and it has been a rewarding experience so far.
What makes it exciting to work in your sector?
It’s a dynamic sector with ever-changing legislation so trying to keep up makes it an exciting challenge. It suits people who get a kick out of working in a multicultural environment and across different time zones. It also feels good to know that my work leads to practical applications for end users as we enable the trade of thousands of everyday goods.
What are your predictions for the global supply chain?
Clients ask me this question a lot and it’s a tough one! I think that following the pandemic, trade will move from a crisis mode to a more normal mode of operating. 2022 was the year when we learnt some lessons from the chaos we faced, and we will accept that some processes will never return to the pre-pandemic times. Still, silver linings such as the possibility of working from home emerged in the aftermath of the pandemic.
What is the corporate culture like in Dublin? Do people still hit the pub at 5pm every day?
Not every day… but most days! In Paris, social interactions between colleagues amounted to the occasional “after work apéro en terrasse”. In Dublin, workers routinely finish their day in the pub. The camaraderie of the Irish workplace makes it easier to make friends and pubs help this, mixing people of all generations and backgrounds, finding it an easy way to share their life stories over a pint… or two.
What is it like being a Colombian in Dublin?
There aren’t many Colombians here. Until recently, we didn’t have access to an embassy, but only a consulate that we could reach once a year. The European media mainly tends to portray Colombia through the lens of its criminality issues and sadly, negative stereotypes still persist and can be exhausting to address. However, references that are more positive are now emerging. People’s curiosity about my country can be amusing: I was once asked if I was related to Gloria from the Modern Family sitcom (I’m not), or how I cope with the weather in Ireland, even though Bogotá is in the coldest and rainiest region of Colombia, so getting used to Dublin’s meteorological conditions hasn’t been at all hard. In any case, as the saying goes here: “the weather here might be cold, but the people are warm”. I have always felt truly welcome here.
Do you feel settled in Dublin now?
It’s interesting that I have never felt so Colombian since living abroad. After 8 years in Ireland, this is home. I applied for and obtained Irish citizenship as a way of showing my gratitude for the opportunities that the country has given me. I also wanted to be able to participate in society and exercise my right to vote. Ireland has held various referendums lately, where citizens have expressed their wish for change on important societal issues such as divorce and abortion. It was inspiring to feel that I could contribute. It’s funny how life plays out: Ireland wasn’t on my radar until a few years ago, and now here I am, a proud Irish citizen! I hold dual citizenship because I will never forget my Colombian roots.
Can we please go back to your boyfriend claiming you are “uncool”?!
Well, he claims that I’m like someone in her seventies (laugh). I admit that I listen to classical music, I bake, I go for walks, I do my grocery shopping with a trolley like a granny. But I have adopted many local traditions, and popping down the pub for a good time is top of my list, so I can’t be that uncool! (laugh).
Any plans for the weekend?
Big plans! Tomorrow I’ll be flying to Colombia with my fiancé for Christmas. I haven’t been in over two years, and I am beyond excited despite the 20-hour flight. Christmas in my country is such a special time. Celebrations start from the 1st December! I am looking forward to some serious wedding planning talks and to watching the Encanto movie… multiple times!
Meeting my soon to be husband here in Ireland has also played a big part in settling in. He is Danish and works in digital advertising. You could say that we represent the two sectors that Ireland is a renowned hub for: finance and tech. My dad is taking English lessons so that’s definitely a sign that he and my mother have come to terms with the fact that I’m not relocating to Colombia any time soon. I imagine that at some point we might move home – to Denmark or Colombia – unless we head to somewhere new that is neutral to both of us. I love the idea that our options are open.
Reading Time: 12 minutes
CEO of De Beers Jewellers and De Beers Forevermark
How did the daughter of a construction contractor with no connections, who grew up in a rural area of south-western France surrounded by cows, ever become the first female CEO of one of the most prestigious jewellery brands in the world? This is the remarkable trajectory of Céline Assimon. In 2001, she started in marketing with Piaget in NYC, then in 2011 for Louis Vuitton in NYC followed by Paris in 2015 as the worldwide head of high jewellery & high watchmaking sales, before re-joining Piaget in Geneva as its international high jewellery director. In 2018, at 41, she landed her first CEO position with Swiss de Grisogono. Today she holds no less than two CEO roles, as the head of De Beers Jewellers and De Beers Forevermark. She takes pride in the mining giant for its engagement in tracing every diamond it discovers and sells, and for raising high business, environmental and social standards for its own operations and the industry as a whole. Céline’s mission is to engage her consumers in both the beauty of the crafted diamonds as well as the beauty of their story, so that these precious symbols of connection and celebration can be worn with pride.
When we explain to Céline that this portrait series aims to reveal the human nature behind Audencia’s iconic alumni, she is immediately up for it. She tells of her regret that she didn’t identify inspiring leaders she could relate to when she was studying at Audencia 20 years ago. At the time, “They all seemed to have this cookie-cutter life, the suit and the wife at home. I wish I’d had access to CEOs who shared their personal stories, successes, mistakes and the fact that you can thrive if you learn from them.”
When looking back at her career to date, Céline makes a point of emphasising the hurdles she had to overcome. She is convinced that she wouldn’t have reached her current position if there hadn’t been a few difficulties and failures along the way. She highlights three in particular: her father’s struggles with running his business, her own countless rejections in the search for her first internship, and the experience of taking de Grisogono through bankruptcy.
Céline has long established her reputation in this coveted industry, but she doesn’t take success for granted. “I am trying to look to the future with a cool head and a dose of humility. Careers nowadays are very fluid, and I might not have my CEO title in a few years from now.” It is with the same refreshing candour that this self-described chameleon, petrol head and bon vivant reveals her immersion into the African American culture, her best red-carpet moments and her signature dish.
You and I are from the same year group and oddly, the first thing I could recollect is that you come from Corrèze. What else can you tell us about your upbringing?
Well remembered! Yes, I did grow up in that rural and remote region of France. This is evidence that distinctive assets are not just useful for brands, but they serve people too!
I am an only child but in a sense, I had a sister in the form of my dad’s business. He owned a construction company, and he was really hands on, working seven days a week. My mum did the accounts for my dad and also worked full time in a small accountancy firm. I followed every step of the journey of our family business. From a young age, I had a good idea of what it takes to run a business and realised early on that hard work doesn’t always pay off. The older I get, the more I look to the past and appreciate that when it comes to my work ethic, the biggest source of inspiration was very close to home.
Have you always wanted to work in the luxury sector?
I was an avid and competitive horse rider and for a long time I wanted to make a career of it. But when I accepted that most professional riders are born into riding families which wasn’t my case, I switched gears. In the small town where I went to school, there weren’t any careers counsellors or anyone to encourage me to sketch out bold dreams for my future. So my journey didn’t start with a vision, but instead with the realisation that I should choose a path that would offer me the widest range of possibilities, even if it meant a scientific baccalaureate with a lot of maths. I always dreaded maths…, which I find quite ironic now that I run big P&Ls …
My first job aged 15 helped me to start working out what would fulfil me in life. I was working in a summer camp, teaching riding to under-privileged 6 to 8 year olds, some from foster care, who lived in rundown housing around Paris (although this wasn’t true for all of them). My family was not wealthy, but they offered me a happy and safe childhood. There was a real “epiphany” moment when I realised that I needed to incorporate an element of gratitude into whatever I was going to pursue, no matter the difficulties and frustrations I would encounter. With my first pay cheque, I bought a ring and that was another revelation. I understood then and there that I was fascinated by craftsmanship; not just for fine jewellery but for any object that has been lovingly and expertly designed. I’ve always been curious about how things are made, by whom and for what occasion. I like the storytelling aspect and decided to find a role that would fulfil me creatively but also provide me the financial means to continue riding. Funnily enough, now that I have the means, I don’t have the time to ride!
While I was figuring it all out, there was one message that my friends – from primary school right up to Audencia – kept telling me: “Don’t worry about the future. You are independent, driven, outspoken, and resilient. You will always fall on your feet, and you know where you want to go.”
You studied a masters’ at Audencia from 1997 to 2001. What are your best memories from that time?
To be honest, I remember less about the curriculum at Audencia than the social life! I was part of the team that organised the triathlon. It was my first experience of project management and I remember the frantic chase to get sponsors. Solène and Hélène, amongst many in the team, were great leaders and partners and team effort was key: if you didn’t pull together, you failed. What an emotional rush it was when a whole year’s work, sweat (and tears) culminated in one huge weekend event!
The semester abroad at the University of Cincinnati (UC) was another highlight. Audencia nominated me for a special international marketing programme. There was only one place and I jumped at the opportunity. What I didn’t know was that it would send me to a different area of the campus, completely separate from fellow Audencians but also from all the other international students. Settling in was tough. With 60,000 students, the campus itself was bigger than my hometown! I was one of the few Caucasians in my dorm and it was a challenge to decipher the working-class African American & Latino culture around me. Although I was out of my comfort zone, I gradually made friends who introduced me to their fraternities. I discovered the realities of students who were juggling multiple jobs in grocery stores, being raised by single mums who in turn were juggling multiple jobs to send their kids to university, in a city where drugs and crime were rife. That was another moment of realisation and gratitude.
You don’t come from a family with connections to the luxury sector. How did you land your first internship?
I was well aware of my disadvantage, so I doubled down on resilience. I recently stumbled on a notepad on which I had listed all the brands I wanted to work for. I had written almost 100 applications and despite being like a dog with a bone, I was turned down by every single company. I was very disappointed, but I switched to my plan B. As a girl raised in the countryside, I enjoyed motorcycling; in fact, I am still a petrol head and fast cars are one of my favourite topics of conversation! This field proved easier for me to crack, but a few weeks before I was due to start an internship with Renault, I received a phone call from Cartier to invite me to an interview. It was for a role in the in-store visual merchandising team and I was so puzzled that I asked the interviewer why they thought I might be the right candidate. She told me that the person they had secured had bailed out on them – a Parisian with connections so the interviewer decided to give the underdog a chance. As it turned out, she was from the Dordogne, noticed my home postcode and was curious! In a nutshell, that’s how I got started. I got my final internship with Piaget in NYC by harassing the VP of marketing with daily phone calls. You can’t guarantee the outcome, but typically a lot of hard work and focus should allow you to get that hoped for result.
How do you explain your skyrocketing career?
In 2001, after finishing my internship in New York, I returned to Nantes to graduate. Everyone was planning their summer vacation and pushing back their job hunt to September. For me, the insecurity of not knowing when my first pay cheque would come in made me anxious: I could not relax on a beach while being uncertain about my professional future! So I was focused on getting into the saddle as quickly as possible. My one-year internship shaped my ambition and I was determined to pursue a career in the luxury industry. In a lucky break, the head of marketing I reported to at Piaget got promoted and I was offered her role. Initially they thought the job was too big for me but I impressed them during the interview and I started on September 3rd in NYC. I think my progression has something to do with my willingness to seize opportunities as they came along.
After 5 years at Piaget, there was nowhere higher for me to go as I was reporting to the CEO and at 27, I was obviously too young & still inexperienced to take his job. So I started looking around for positions in Europe but with an American corporate mindset. Over there, recruiters expect you to do vertical or lateral moves every three years or so. In France on the other hand, I was told repeatedly to stay put and favour stability, something I refused to do. I had my sights set on LVMH and, even if it took me a few years, I got there in the end. What I have always avoided is complacency. The moment I am in a role where I just need to steer the ship, I get less excited. I am a builder; I like to create from scratch, develop my toolbox, and define my management style along the way. At least that’s how it works for me at the moment; maybe in 5 years’s time I will have less energy for that.
Sometimes, however, the opportunities I seized led to difficult situations. For example, I had to take a company through bankruptcy after the loss of shareholder support. Some people would have just left and let the liquidators handle it, but I decided to be there and support the team as much as I could. Emotionally, it was very hard but the way I manage my teams, P&L and cash flow today is definitely coloured by this experience. I never want to go through that again.
When I look back, the risks I took in different companies, sizes and cultures have paid off. I know I have big areas for improvement, but I also know that I am a bit of a chameleon, and that adaptability is an asset of mine.
Do you feel that being a woman has ever brought extra challenges?
20 years ago, when I started in the industry, it felt like I had stepped into a gentleman’s club. The environment was very masculine, paternalistic even, with clients being invited to sign deals over a cigar or on the golf course. Early on, I had to learn to stand up for myself and push back when I was put into situations that didn’t align with my values. Fortunately, the world has moved on and it was worth hanging in there because at one point or another, organisations bid farewell to those toxic personalities.
I have been lucky to report to many powerful women – in particular at Cartier and Vuitton, who displayed exemplary managerial behaviour with kindness and fairness. Many of the men in leadership positions in the luxury industry had limited field experience. To stand out from the crowd, I was keen to demonstrate my ability to roll up my sleeves and pull together with the teams who were dealing with clients on a day-to-day basis. It gave me credibility, which made me a better manager: my teams know they can come to me and I’ll have their back. What I was lacked in connections and in masculinity, I made up for with business acumen and kinship with the people who deliver the business.
Tell us more about your current double CEO role
De Beers is a widely known brand because one third of the natural diamonds that are recovered globally come from a De Beers mine in South Africa, Namibia, Botswana or Canada. In September 2020, the group CEO invited me to join a junior division – the brand and consumer market unit, and take over the De Beers Jewellers brand. Then, in September 2021, I was also tasked with leading the De Beers Forevermark brand, so we can approach the market with a differentiated offer. Forevermark caters to a more premium clientele and every one of its diamond comes with the promise that it is beautiful, rare and responsibly sourced. Less than 1% of the world’s natural diamonds are eligible for selection as a De Beers Jewellers and De Beers Forevermark.
You mentioned traceability. The mining industry has a legacy of social and environmental controversies until more recent transformations. How is CSR part of your role?
In 2006, after the Blood Diamond movie was released, De Beers implemented brand new processes to secure its supply chain and was instrumental in setting up a standard for the industry to ensure that the diamonds sold are conflict free. When I joined De Beers, the processes were being strengthened further, and we realised that we could only thrive by transforming into a purpose-led company. De Beers is strongly invested in leading ethical practices, protecting the natural world, and partnering local communities. For example, we have recently celebrated 11 years during which, thanks to the healthcare provided, no employees’ babies were born with HIV. This was very uplifting for me even if consumers were not aware of what goes on behind the scenes. For my first year I had two key objectives: the first was to put creativity back into the brand, pushing the limits in terms of aesthetic and research. The second was to translate the values that we live by and the positive impact we are making into a clear narrative for consumers.
In the countries where we operate, there are no alternative resources to natural diamonds; the gems allow boys -and girls- to go to school, get healthcare and get a leg up in life. I know it might be laughable to think that luxury and social purpose can go together but it comforts me to know that in a way, I’m not just helping one more woman to look pretty, but I am also contributing to doing some good in the world.
Now for an essential question: we assume that your role also involves engaging with your brands’ celebrity ambassadors and glamming them up for their red-carpet appearances. Are there any big names you’d like to drop for us?
Ah ha! Well, I have met many stunning and smart celebrities along the way. From my recent encounters, I would say that Cindy Bruna is wise beyond her years and as sharp and kind as she is beautiful. I have met Alec Baldwin – recently in the news for the tragic reasons I won’t mention. I hosted him and his wife Hilaria at a New York event a couple of years ago; it was quite refreshing and fun to discuss politics and current affairs with him.
Is there a particular city that your business travels have led you to and that you’d like to single out?
China is a priority for our network development over the coming year. Our latest store opened in Chengdu at the IFS Mall. Chengdu is one of my favourite cities in China: it’s very sophisticated yet anchored in unique surroundings (and home of the panda!). In normal times, I’d typically go there a couple of times a year.
What do you do in your spare time? Do you manage to leave your work behind?
I have a daughter who is 10 and her father and I are divorced. He is a diplomat currently based in Qatar and before that he was in Afghanistan, so my daughter is with me full time. I want to be there for her, so it often means that I forego my own needs and I just grab little moments for myself whenever I can. I know it’s going to sound shallow, but I love having my hair done! It’s my treat. Joking apart, I don’t hike, paraglide or climb mountains, that’s not me. But I am a pretty good cook and my kitchen is my happy place. “Confit de canard aux pommes de terre sarladaises”* was already a signature dish of mine during my years at Audencia! I love hosting meals and mixing people; this is what I miss the most from my pre-Covid world. There’s nothing like a fabulous meal with different people to reinvent the world.
Overall, I find it hard to unplug – I guess because I never saw my family doing so, but also because it’s a privilege to feel so passionately about my job. I am conscious of how my behaviour influences others, especially my daughter. I want her to have a career as fulfilling as mine, but I am also aware that we shouldn’t be so caught up in it that we forget to manage time for ourselves. Retirement might well be a disaster for me!
*a speciality from Céline’s native region in southwestern France; duck confit served with potatoes cooked in goose fat, garlic and parsley.
Reading Time: 11 minutes
Country Director for Southern Africa at The World Bank
Marie Françoise Marie-Nelly’s life is showered with a series of events that, in hindsight, could be good premonitions. At her boarding school for girls, she used to stand on the balcony admiring the sunset over the bay of Fort de France in her native Martinique. She longed to know where the cruise ships were heading and dreamt of faraway destinations. Later, she crossed the Atlantic Ocean for her post-high school preparatory classes at Lycée Clémenceau in Nantes, France. On her first day, she noticed a memorial plaque inscribed with the following words by the French statesman, Georges Clémenceau, “Without waiting for the future and the fortune of your efforts, roll up your sleeves resolutely, and create your destiny.” This message inspired her entire career. In 1986, when she was studying for her master’s degree at Bowling Green State University – Ohio, USA, she visited Washington DC and, by chance, walked past the headquarters of the World Bank. In a moment of deep awareness, she knew intuitively that one day she would work for this institution.
Throughout her life, Marie Françoise has been mindful to perceive, respond and give expression to the signals and opportunities in life, with these signals indeed guiding her deepest motivations and objectives. Her perceptiveness, combined with a sharp mind and tremendous dedication, are probably what helped her achieve her successes and reach the position she is holding today. She has lived by the motto that nothing is impossible when you put your mind and tons of hard work into it.
Today, at the head of a large team, Marie-Françoise leads the World Bank’s strategic and operational interventions in Southern Africa, including South Africa, Botswana, Namibia, Lesotho and Eswatini, identifying innovative development solutions and mobilising funding for their implementation. Her accomplishments are impressive, including restructuring and privatising public enterprises in Western Africa, liberalising air transport and telecom sectors across the continent, designing the World Bank’s approach to regional integration for sub-Saharan Africa, identifying complex infrastructure projects, leading the Chad-Cameroon oil pipeline project, and structuring the World Bank’s interventions to support the economic transition across the Maghreb countries.
Her commitment to development throughout her career has commanded the respect of government representatives, citizens, colleagues, and friends wherever she has worked. Whether through her official positions by fostering economic progress in developing nations, or in her private life, she has always been motivated by a desire to give back and build a better future. Where does she get this unwavering drive and optimism? This optimism is anchored in strong family values given by her parents. Marie Françoise also deeply believes that world progress will be achieved by giving young people a fair opportunity to unleash their potential. Let’s meet a woman with exemplary human qualities, who is equally at ease in advising some of the world’s most powerful leaders as chatting with youngsters from the townships.
Tell us about your childhood in Martinique
I had a very happy childhood in a large close-knit family with six brothers and four sisters. My mother devoted her life to her 11 children and I never heard her complain once. My father played a key role in the agriculture sector. As an executive for the Chamber of Agriculture, he led the implementation of agrarian reforms that allowed farmers to access to farmland ownership, diversify their crops and improve their farming practices. Thanks to this programme, most Martinicans now possess productive assets which were inexistent when Martinique was still a French colony.
I remember having a great sense of freedom during my childhood. Our lives were marked by the calendar of cultural events and religious festivities throughout the year. Our parents instilled in us a sense of determination, hard work, compassion, and search for excellence in everything we endeavoured. The Catholic faith, generosity and solidarity were some of the foundations of our upbringing. Interestingly, as the eighth child growing up between two boys, I developed a healthy sense of competition very early on.
Are you a born leader?
From a young age, I strove for high standards and leadership roles came naturally. I was regularly chosen as the class leader, and I thrived in the Girls Scouts. While I did not have a specific dream job in mind, I knew that I wanted to play an important leadership role. I also knew that I did not want to assume leadership for personal advancement, but rather as a unique opportunity to contribute significantly to society.
Looking through the Audencia 1978 yearbook, there was a balanced gender mix, but black students were an exception at the time. Did you suffer any prejudice?
Being uprooted at the age of 17 to join a preparatory class in mainland France was understandably unsettling, but fortunately some of my older siblings were already studying medicine and computer science in Nantes. Having them nearby was reassuring and I have fond memories of us getting together every Sunday at my sister’s house. Later at Audencia, there were only two non-white students in class – me and a male student from Madagascar. Being a high performer probably helped me to fit in more easily – during the first year I was top of the class. I never felt discriminated against. On the contrary, I was made to feel most welcome and received regular invitations to spend weekends at my classmates’ families which also helped me discover Brittany and Pays de la Loire regions.
Tell us about your career before joining the World Bank
In 1977, for my final year, my dad secured an internship for me at the Club Med resort in Martinique. Instead, I chose a different opportunity in Gabon and am eternally grateful for this choice because the experience shaped my career and nurtured my keen interest in working in development, particularly in Africa. Three years later, at the age of 23, I had my first international contract, in the Ivory Coast as a management consultant for the French Management Consulting Group CEGOS. This was during the rise of the Ivorian miracle. President Houphouët Boigny had planned the construction of 12 sugar complexes at a time when sugar prices had skyrocketed. Eventually, only six complexes were built by international firms under turnkey contracts, but the President decided to transfer the management to nationals, and I found myself being the only woman in a team of five experts to put the company’s management systems in place. This first significant position in a prominent West African country served as my gateway to the continent.
I then returned to France to complete my Certified Public Accountant diploma and secured a job at “La Villette”, one of the “Grands Travaux” of the newly elected President François Mitterrand. My task was to estimate the future operating costs of what became later the City of Science and Industry, the National Science and Industry Museum. I was surrounded by eminent French scientists who were not focused on cost but on innovative ideas! I met influential people, some of whom were in the presidential circle, and this sparked the beginning of my understanding of decision-making processes. In 1984, I obtained a scholarship from the Rotary Foundation, which financed my MBA studies at Bowling Green University while being a goodwill ambassador representing the West Indies.
Following my graduate studies, I was offered the opportunity to help establish a management institute in Burundi, as the country’s educated élite had been decimated by genocide in the early 1970s. I was thrown in at the deep end when the project director backed out just before my arrival and I was asked to lead the project. During the day, I was setting up the institute from scratch and in the evenings I was teaching management and accounting to adult students from the government and private sectors. Subsequently, as advisor to the Minister of Public Enterprises and Privatisation in Burundi and then in Togo, I worked on some sensitive cases, which really enhanced my expertise and honed my understanding of leadership challenges. By the end of this assignment, I had helped several countries tackle one of the biggest economic challenges they faced after independence, namely,promoting the creation of a domestic private sector. In 1993, I applied to the World Bank in Washington thinking I would stay there about a year to build up a strong network and, 28 years later, I am still ‘here’, having worked in different parts of the institution and countries from West to Central, North, and now South of the African continent!
You have worked as task manager, programme manager, senior programme manager and now regional director at the World Bank. What were the defining factors in the progression of your career?
I started to work as a task team leader on the privatisation of a diverse set of state-owned companies with mandates ranging from production sectors such as cement factories, agro-industries, petroleum refineries, to service sectors such as banks and telecom services. Building on my pre-Bank experience, I learned how to see the strategic, big picture, while also being able to understand the implementation challenges which can make projects unsuccessful. In fact, the ability to integrate technical aspects was one of the key learnings from my time at Audencia. Leading the very controversial Chad-Cameroon pipeline project allowed me to appreciate the importance of the political economy in whatever we do. All in all, what has helped me grow was not a career plan as such but a capacity to lead my professional journey in the way you would build a jigsaw puzzle, integrating elements, skills and experiences that initially do not appear to be connected. This is a recommendation I always offer to young people.
Some critics accuse the World Bank of being an ivory tower with staff who are out of touch with the reality on the ground, thus generating bureaucracy instead of alleviating poverty. What are your thoughts on this?
At one point, this perception was probably somewhat justified. However, from 1995 to 2005, we were lucky to have had a visionary President, James Wolfensohn. The transformative initiatives he implemented earned him the nickname of “Renaissance Banker”. He realised the importance of a diverse workforce, recruiting local talent, and decentralising decision-making power. The institution is now much more open, attentive to the needs of its clients and agile in its response.
When I joined the World Bank at the age of 35, my early experience in the field had already shaped my commitment to development. Our direct clients are the governments of the respective countries we are serving, although I am fully aware of the importance of civil society involvement as the people of a country are the ultimate beneficiaries of our work.
When I assumed my current position in South Africa, I vowed to visit a township every month and I always find this reality check particularly enlightening. Just yesterday I was chairing a meeting on the design of an education project in Eswatini (formerly called Swaziland), and I insisted that we engage with the beneficiaries, because ultimately, they are the ones who can judge the effectiveness of a programme.
Has being a woman meant you have faced any extra challenges?
When I joined the World Bank, being a woman of colour from France was not necessarily an asset. The discrimination I suffered was mainly insidious. Sometimes, it resulted in not getting the positions I aspired to, explained away by deceptive reasons. This simply motivated me to redouble my efforts and strive to remain professional and dignified at all times, including during difficult handovers. And, just like when I was a girl, I kept my gaze laser-focused on the horizon. This is another piece of advice that I share with young people: resilience, courage, and convictions do pay off in the long run.
However, I also acknowledge that the institution has made a lot of progress. President Wolfensohn was proactive in opening the Bank to a more diverse staff, women, people from minority groups, which unleashed a lot of new energy. And, like many organisations, it has had to face challenges around racism. In the aftermath of the George Floyd protests, a taskforce was set up to analyse how accusations of racism are and could be better dealt with internally.
What brings purpose and meaning to your everyday life?
I cannot imagine life without being involved in social responsibility initiatives. I have led social initiatives in each of my positions. In DR Congo, I funded projects to help get children off the streets and provide vocational rehabilitation for young people with disabilities. I organised similar projects in Nigeria focusing on war widows. In Morocco, I led a project supporting migrants arriving from sub-Saharan Africa. I have always been active on a personal level as well. I set up a foundation to help AIDS orphans and we were active in four countries. I have been sponsoring two young Nigerian orphans. In South Africa, during the immediate Covid-19 period, I campaigned for funding to feed hundreds of vulnerable migrants whom at that stage were not supported by the government’s social safety nets.
For me, there’s nothing more rewarding than empowering people who have a strong potential but are challenged because of difficult circumstances such as conflict or lack of economic opportunities.
I have read that you are a bit of a workaholic; do you confirm this?
Yes, I believe it is true! I can still see myself at my desk, for yet another late evening at the World Bank headquarters in DC. The night guards were patrolling the huge offices and one stopped by my desk to inform me: “Mam’! Not sure you’re aware of this but you are the only employee left in the building!” It was Christmas Eve. I was leaving the following day for Martinique to be with my family, and being the conscientious woman that I am, I wanted to go through all my files and tie up any loose ends before I left. However, I was so embarrassed that I packed up and went home immediately!
This determination goes back to my childhood. I guess it is a continuous quest for excellence and to some extent I can’t help it. But that doesn’t mean I don’t have any other interests! I know when I need to take a breather and process my thoughts. I love being surrounded by young people. I like sports and I am currently working on a new challenge, moving from tennis to golf, which will be gentler on my knees. In addition, I try to make the most of my international business trips to understand other cultures better.
What strategies do you think Audencia should pursue to continue to catalyse positive change?
The international outlook, which has been Audencia’s signature for decades, is a fantastic asset that should be cultivated. Secondly, I like that the school has opened over time. I am a pure product of the French public school system. My parents made it a point to find ways for me to access quality education. The school should focus further on recruiting students from more varied social backgrounds because diversity drives innovation. This is precisely the reason why I contribute to the Audencia Foundation. Thirdly, the school should continue to strive for academic excellence because this is the best arm against prejudice.
Is there anything that you are particularly looking forward to in the coming weeks?
Yes, there is! Here in South Africa, we have a long weekend coming up for the celebration of Heritage Day. I will be heading to a wellness centre I go to when I need to take some time for myself. It’s on a farm, an hour from Pretoria. I will go on hiking at sunset, again at dawn, and enjoy some hydrotherapy in between. I am going on my own and am unlikely to bump into anyone from work!
It is tempting nowadays to get bogged down with what seems like an insurmountable accumulation of crises. Do you sometimes despair about the future of humanity?
I am an unwavering optimist. Look at the journey that humanity has taken: it has always been fraught with crises, but we have always recovered. To take the Covid-19 crisis example; I am convinced that it will spark some profoundly positive changes, one of which is our ability to reclaim something valuable which is time for ourselves, and to be better prepared to face such global health crises. When you step back to analyse long-term trends, you note that civilisation has made tremendous progress. In recent history, when African countries obtained independence, only 20% of young people had access to university, but today, there are many outstanding scholars in key positions all over the world!
I have one major concern though, and that is the climate crisis. I see its devastating effects first-hand, with longer, more frequent droughts and heavier rainfall that destroy crops. This is going to be the issue of our time in the years to come: how do we rethink the balance on Earth so there is space for everyone, less inequality, for the younger generation to thrive and remain hopeful.
Finally, young people make me optimistic. I get this from my mother whose motto has always been “The only secret to remaining young is to surround yourself with young people.” I believe that the only way forward is to involve young people in decision-making processes. Therefore, in each of my roles as director, I have established a youth platform. Every time I meet young people, I am amazed by their resourcefulness for innovation, confirming my hopes for a better, albeit a different, future.
Reading Time: 10 minutes
Life coach and reiki master
When we reached out to Henar Cabrera, she was living in Dublin and working as an International Customer Service Representative for Blue Nile, an American online jewellery retailer. Fast forward to our interview only two weeks later, and she had relocated to San Sebastian in Spain, and was proudly calling herself a life coach and reiki master. We got swept away by one of those conversations that seemed to take on a life of its own. Full of twists and turns, just like Henar’s life, in fact.
Growing up, Henar didn’t venture much further than her native Madrid, but her life changed gear the moment she understood she had to scratch that travel bug itch.
Audencia’s EIBM programme allowed her to lay the first stone of her international career. From Spain, to France, to Germany, to China, to Ireland and back to Spain, Henar’s journey is a travelogue as much as a story of professional transition and spiritual quest. A quest for healing from childhood trauma, for independence, for Mr. Right, for a purposeful job, and, above all, for finding her true self. Henar has come full circle and returned to her home country; along the way, she has found her mission, to motivate and heal others so they can live their best life. Full of wisdom, Henar’s words encourage us to soothe our mind and to trust and listen to our heart, the essence of our being and a reservoir of joy. They will inspire anyone who finds themselves questioning their life choices.
Tell me a little bit about your childhood in Madrid
It wasn’t all that straightforward, dealing with my childhood wounds; it took me years of therapy to accept that parents bring their own childhood traumas to the way they raise their kids, and that they did the best they could with the resources they had. As a child, I was an introvert, with dreams of a fulfilling life, imagining the full package: a successful career, a loving husband, and a house full of children. Now I suspect that those desires were in fact other people’s projections, rather than my own dreams.
Was the international career part of your plan?
The urge to venture outside my home country came to me quite late, with parents who were civil servants, I was raised in a very Spanish or local mind-set. The international seed started to grow after I went to study on a university exchange programme in Utrecht in The Netherlands. When I returned to Madrid, I got a job in TV news production for three years. I am aware of how glamorous that sounds, and I was grateful for the experience but at the same time, I couldn’t shake the feeling that it wasn’t my calling. I knew that something was missing, I craved adventure, I wanted to learn new languages and immerse myself in different cultures.
I was insecure about this dream for a long time so I decided to go abroad again to study, thinking it would give me the confidence and the foundations I needed for an international career. When I discovered Audencia’s European and International Business Management programme, it felt like the absolute right path to take.
What appealed to you about the EIBM programme?
The programme consisted of a rotation every three months in three different countries: Spain (Bilbao), France (Nantes) and the UK (Bradford), which I found particularly exciting. It focused on international business with a solid curriculum in international law, finance and human resources. However, to be honest, I picked this programme primarily for the international opportunities it offered.
Unlike many students, I had no preconceived plan when I enrolled. I admired and, at times, envied those rational and determined people, and blamed myself for my lack of direction and confidence. I am much gentler with myself now, because I recognise how much of a leap of faith this move had been for me. Today I know myself better and I accept that intuition and spirituality drive me more than rationality.
Did the programme fulfil its promise?
The curriculum was heavy on numbers, which overwhelmed me for the first few months, especially as I was studying in a different language. However, I surprised myself with my ability to hang in there despite the difficulties. I felt encouraged by a strong force, which I can only attribute to God. I was not at ease with the networking aspect either, but I knew that it was an essential part of the experience. I pushed myself to connect with the other students and gradually it felt more natural. In France and Spain, my timetable was quite dense. At Bradford, the schedule was lighter with more assignments than contact hours so this gave me more time to socialise. This was how I met the man who took me to China…
Tell us about your professional peregrinations
I found a job in Paris; which I don’t think I would have managed without my experience in Nantes. It was a blissful time, working for Windrose, selling documentaries and other TV content all over the world. It was the perfect way to combine my media background with my international business skills. The French community accepted me as one of their own. I was lucky to attend high profile events such as the Cannes International TV market and it was gratifying to realise that I had become comfortable with networking. It goes to show that you can always develop your ideal personality type. I recall one evening in Cannes, when we celebrated a friend’s birthday: she was Russian – we’d met in Spain – and we partied with interesting people from all over the world. I felt in total harmony in this international environment, as if the stars had aligned for me.
When my boss took on a role in Germany, she suggested I go with her and I accepted in a heartbeat, excited to step into yet another universe. However, after a few months, the workload and the stress had become so unbearable that I one day I suffered a panic attack in in the office. My inner awareness kicked in again and pushed me to extract myself from this unhealthy situation. I realised that my curiosity was tempting me to explore even further. By a strange twist of fate, my boyfriend at the time – with whom I’d had a long-distance relationship for several years, had just decided to return to Taiwan where he was from so I upped sticks and went with him. The administrative formalities to obtain a visa were frankly a hassle but then Swedbrand, an international packaging company, recruited and sponsored me. I enjoyed some business trips in Europe, however I pushed myself to reach my sales target at the cost of my own wellbeing again. Then in 2016, I got a job as a customer service representative at Blue Nile, an online jewellery company, and that position was such a blessing.
So what led you to coaching?
After suffering from work-related anxiety for many years, I finally found working environments in China that made me feel at peace. I was in the right state of mind for some introspective work, and this is how I discovered my interest in coaching. I realised that my friends often came to me to share whatever challenge there were going through, and I was naturally a good listener. I started to believe that I could leverage this trustworthiness and make a career out of it so I enrolled on evening classes in coaching and stepped into a close-knit community. This was a wonderful and balanced phase in my life: my daytime job provided me with an international outlook and stability and in the evenings, I was exploring this new activity that made me feel so alive. I started organising motivational and self-development workshops as a freelance coach. I was amazed to have found a path that I could build with my own hands and which gave me so much joy.
Why did you move back to Europe then?
The relationship with my now ex-boyfriend didn’t work out. With hindsight, I could have predicted that before moving to the other side of the world with him, but I don’t have any regrets. I had to go through those experiences to gain self-awareness. So, I found myself single in China where I felt settled, with a job that I liked, a supportive friendship network and this fulfilling passion project with coaching. Nevertheless, I was craving a relationship; I continued dating, but I had a feeling that I would find love in Europe. I remember going to Spain for the summer holidays and realising how lovely life was in Europe. I decided that a new lifestyle was within my reach and that I should move while I was still young and unattached. My employer, Blue Nile, had a European base in Ireland, and they were happy to transfer me there.
So was Ireland the place that finally ticked all the boxes?
Not quite, but here’s a scoop! I found my true love and life partner in Ireland, and we are engaged to be married! I also certified as a life coach, which is a proud achievement. My corporate life, however, felt unsettling again. My sales targets had increased, along with my stress levels so one week ago, I resigned from secure employment to embrace my soul mission. I hadn’t imagined that my transition towards coaching would be so radical and sudden. My initial plan was to build a secure client base before moving into coaching full time, but there was a point when I felt totally bogged down. Carrying out both activities in parallel became difficult because my corporate job was demanding for my brain, and when I coached it became difficult to shift my focus to my heart and guts. I am grateful to my employer for their trust, but I have accepted that for me there is something more to life than a 9 to 5 corporate job, which suffocates my soul. Today I am ready to spend more time being closer to the unknown and the uncomfortable, until I figure out the next stage of my life.
Congratulations on the upcoming wedding! Where is your fiancé from? Ireland? China?
Ha ha! He’s Australian actually! He teaches English and we share the same passion for discovering other cultures. If we add up the countries that we have each lived in, it comes to 13! We met in Ireland and he’s the one who felt the urge to relocate. He was craving the sun and the sea and he found a job in San Sebastian. He has offered to support me while I set up my business and I trust him in his knowledge of what is best for the two of us. So I have moved back to Spain out of love for him and this is how I have reconnected with my homeland after 12 years away.
So have you managed to align with your life purpose?
I am definitely on the right track! I coach people in finding and planning for what they truly desire. I am also a reiki master; the objective is therapeutic, it’s about helping people to heal from past trauma, so they feel in harmony with the present and themselves. And since I am passionate about relationships and dating, I also offer what I call “Eat, Pray, Love” coaching. Some women -including me, have been struggling with toxic and even abusive relationships. They get caught up in the same pattern, which often also affects their professional relationships. I am here to support women navigating through a breakup, healing a broken heart, returning to the dating arena, and forming a sacred union. All these disciplines can be powerful tools to make the most of this one short life we have.
Do you regret your past educational and career choices or even see them as a waste of time?
I have no regrets whatsoever, I have been figuring out my life as it’s been unfolding. It took me these long exploratory phases to accept that corporate life is not for everyone, despite the remarkable comfort and security it brings. My parents still struggle to understand my choices but I know that the pressure that they still put on me to achieve their version of success comes from a good place. I value their opinions, but I am now much better at following my own desires.
Are there any recommendations you would like to share with Audencia students and alumni who are currently trying to figure out their own personal journeys?
As a life coach, I don’t like to give advice. I know that people have to figure out their own journey. What I am certain about is that fulfilment starts with being aware of the expectations that others have for us – our parents, friends, teachers, etc. Then it’s about connecting with our heart; our heart is wiser than the rational model we have been taught to follow. My recommendation is to listen to what you truly desire beyond all those social projections. A heart-centred and joyful life is much more empowering than the false sense of security provided by the logical and capitalistic world we live in. I know that the process can be terrifying, but trust me, once you take that leap of faith, the doors open.
You have mentioned God several times. Have you always been guided by spirituality?
I was raised a Catholic but as an adult I disconnected from my faith. I remember, aged 28, when I was living in Germany and had just returned from visiting my now ex-boyfriend in the UK. It was freezing cold, I was walking along the street, my arms loaded with grocery bags, and I was missing my boyfriend. Sometimes living abroad can feel very lonely. I came across a church and I will never forget the feeling when I stepped inside of being hugged by God. Reconnecting with my religion has helped me tremendously in overcoming all sorts of challenges. On days when my sales results were miles away off target and my stress levels were through the roof, I would find comfort in the Bible. Did you know that in the Bible, the phrase “Don’t worry” features 365 times? I now ask God for guidance at each important step.
It might be a difficult question because you are in the middle of another transition, as you have just moved to a new city, are about to get married and set up your business, but, do you have any idea where you would like to be in 5 or 10 years’ time? What do you wish for yourself?
What I truly desire is to be able to earn a living in a way that is in synch with my soul, using my talents for a higher purpose, to serve the community, to touch others, to be independent and to create wealth from within.
Is there anything that you are looking forward to doing this week?
I have been away from my fiancé for a couple of months so I can’t wait to see him. I am also looking forward to my regular running session along the esplanade. Running gives me the opportunity to leave my problems behind for an hour, and feed my soul and body with mindfulness and endorphins. Watching the sun come up while you are jogging is a beautiful way to show gratitude for the gift of life and to start the day with intention!
Reading Time: 9 minutes
Assistant Minister of Agricultural Development and Food Security, Botswana
It took 6 months to pin her down for a promised interview, but given our subject’s status, we knew that we had to be patient and understanding. To say that Beauty Manake has a jam-packed schedule is an understatement. Not even a year and a half into her first and prominent political role, she is in charge of nothing less than Botswana’s food security and agricultural strategy, and the pandemic has forced her country into a state of public emergency. This mother of two and CEO of Kungo Farms has gone into politics with a view of fulfilling her long-held dream: transforming agricultural practices in order to ensure the self-sufficiency and sustainability of the country she loves intensely.
We are glad to have persevered because, as a result, we get a special glimpse into the fascinating life of a high-profile yet unorthodox politician. Beauty shares her memories of an upbringing, which did not preordain her to the eminent career she leads. She tells us why, swimming against the tide, she decided to move into farming and she recalls in vivid detail the day she found out about her ministerial role. In fact, once we get Beauty on the phone, she talks enthusiastically and endlessly. “Forgive me, I’m a politician, I talk too much!” she apologises, tongue in cheek. Revealing her candid nature, she confesses, “Thank you for hunting me down so relentlessly for this interview. I didn’t realise I had so much to share about my own life story. I am so glad for the opportunity you have given me to appreciate where I come from and what I have accomplished”.
You don’t come from a long line of politicians. What is your family background?
That’s right. I grew up in Selibe Phikwe, a small mining town in eastern Botswana where my father was a miner. My mother stayed at home to look after my siblings and I, and when we reached our teens, she started a small import business. She travelled to South Africa where the land is greener, to buy fruits and vegetables, returning to sell them in our community. My brother and I took turns to travel with her and help her out. My parents were miles away from the political sphere, but I got there by dint of hard work, an attitude that they instilled in me.
How did you end up in a white-collar job at a diamond company?
My aunt had a strong influence on my life choices. Her son was one of the few Batswana to graduate from Harvard. She was strict, had high expectations for my academic achievements and pushed me to become a doctor. But I have always been strong-minded and I chose my own path. When I enrolled in a business and information systems course, my decision didn’t go down well with her. She told me, with a hint of sarcasm, “Good choice! Then when you graduate you can manage your mother’s tomato business”. I found this prospect ludicrous, and I was slightly offended at the time. In a funny twist of fate, here I am today the proud owner of a 35-hectare vegetable farm, and my aunt has become one of my fiercest supporters.
After university, I landed a well-paid job as systems technologist at De Beers, the diamond company. This was where every graduate dreamt of working because of the pay and the benefits, but in time, I felt out of place. When the activity slowed down during the 2008 recession, we were instructed to simply wait for the European market to pick up again, and I found this strategy frustrating and demoralising.
What first motivated your transition into farming?
After visiting hundreds of farms in South Africa with my mother, I came to appreciate the farming life. And I did the maths: with her vegetable business, my mother was making more per week than I was! I figured that if I set up a farm, my mother would not have to travel long distances anymore, and she could buy from me instead. In addition, in Botswana we are lucky to have access to a huge amount of land – our country has an area roughly the size of France for a population of only 2.1 million. Lastly, I wanted to contribute to making my country more self-reliant.
I handed in my resignation to De Beers, explaining that I wanted to be my own boss. They tried to retain me with the prospect of a secondment to the UK. However, I had enough confidence to believe that somehow, I would find my own way to Europe.
So was the process of setting up your farm as smooth as you had anticipated?
In 2013, aged 25, I applied for funding and set up Kungo Farms. The first few years were tough. My mother disapproved of my decision to “reduce myself to becoming a farmer”. She aspired for me to enjoy a more comfortable life than hers and thought I deserved a career in the corporate world. She wanted me to rock up those stilettos!
Naively, I had thought that my exposure to farming through my mother was enough but it was definitely far more challenging than I’d expected. I particularly struggled to access the market. Then, developing my venture suffered a huge setback when I had a bad car accident on my way to the farm. It took me almost 6 months to be able to walk again. I do not know what my business would have become if it hadn’t been for my father who paid my workers out of his own wages during that time.
How did the Food & Agribusiness Management degree at Audencia change your vision of agribusiness?
There came a point when I felt I’d finally grasped the agricultural production ecosystem and the immediate needs of the market. But I wanted to become properly skilled in agricultural business and be able to forecast the trends. I am fortunate that my husband – a geotechnical engineer, is as passionate about farming as I am. He encouraged me to pursue further studies to professionalise our farming enterprise. He wanted me to become a “smart educated farmer” who can make a difference.
I chose to study at Audencia because of the well-designed curriculum and the dual programme in Brazil. My sponsorship application was approved, and this is how, in September 2014, I ended up in Nantes. The curriculum was outstanding and I was especially surprised by how much I learnt about my own continent. The experience was also testing. I quickly mastered the phrase “Je ne parle pas français” but people would carry on speaking to me in French regardless! And everything was so damn expensive, which came as a shock as in Botswana, the government has provided for us most of our lives. However, I learnt the tricks of surviving on a budget.
How did you become an expert in sustainable agribusiness?
After 6 months in Nantes and a further 6 months in Sao Paulo, I came home a different person. The programme totally opened my mind to sustainable thinking. I felt ready to apply all this knowledge and to run a business that would be critical in developing my rural environment. As a country, we have been resting on our laurels for too long, spoiled by abundant diamond reserves. We have been importing food excessively, just because we could afford it – not a sustainable strategy. Food waste is also a cultural issue: for instance, at funerals and weddings, hosts always provide excessive amounts of food, as a wealth indicator. We must also work harder at conserving water and electricity. I have made it my mission to change both the system and the mindset.
With a few agro-dealers, we had this idea of setting up an event that would have educational values beyond the traditional trade shows. I pushed the sustainability agenda, we invited all the key players to join the conversation, from the grassroots organisations all the way to the senior executives at the diamond companies, and I started leading a sort of green revolution. Soon after, Lucara, a Canadian diamond Company operating in Botswana approached me. They had heard about my work as they were looking to expand into sustainable agriculture, and they employed me as a CSR consultant.
How did you make the jump from farming to politics?
The president of Botswana is also originally a farmer. I first met him when he was vice-president and I challenged him on different policies. I remember thinking: “He is eloquent and smart, a visionary; he is taking the time to answer my questions, I can see myself working with this guy!” My vision was of a transformed rural economy where a vibrant agricultural sector would help people move back from the towns to the villages. I was applying that model as a consultant and although I was impacting only a few people’s lives, I had proven that I had nailed it. The VP paid attention, we got to know each other better, and I invited him to open some sessions at our show. In 2019, just a few days after he won the presidential elections, he asked me to submit my CV. I assumed he was looking for an advisor or a public officer, but in truth, I had no idea what I was applying for. Straight afterwards, I left for a holiday with friends in Durban, South Africa.
I will never forget the day I received that phone call! We were getting ready to go out for dinner and feeling blissfully relaxed after time in the spa. My phone rang; I glanced at the screen and yelled at my friend, “It’s His Excellency! It’s the President!” He said that he needed to meet me urgently and that he would send a car to pick me up from the airport. I just managed to squeeze in a quick shopping session, because, as a farm girl, I had no formal clothes. An hour later, wearing my brand-new suit, I was in his office at the State House and I had the shock of my life when he asked me to join his cabinet and actually be part of the decision-makers. He asked me for my thoughts and I accepted on the spot. I explained that the job was in line with what I had been advocating for years and was an opportunity for me to build a sustainable future for my kids and the generations to come. To which he replied, “Great, now let’s get to work”. In November 2019, I joined the ministry.
Has your financial and social status had an impact on your family?
20 years ago, when I was going around farms in South Africa with my mum, I spotted the wonderful Stanford Lake College with its first-world aura. I knew that my mother didn’t have the means to send me there, but I dreamt that one day my children would. Today, I am proud that the elder of my two boys – who are 14 and 9 – is a pupil there. The wealth that I have achieved through farming has also allowed me to make sure that my parents are comfortable. I have built a nice house for them in our home village. Now my mother doesn’t need to travel to South Africa. They have moved to my farm where I have delegated the day-to-day operations to a team.
When she realised how fulfilling it was for me, my mother began to support my decision to go into farming. My parents admire my move into politics. The other day, my dad was queuing at the bank and a customer told him “Have a seat sir, come on; your daughter is the minister!” He was flattered and beaming with pride, but he didn’t want to appear arrogant. Personally, I still haven’t really adjusted to my new status! I don’t call myself a minister, I just see my job as a fantastic opportunity to transform my country. I have not defined the position yet and I do not let the position define me. If, at the end of the five-year term, I am able to implement my vision and deliver results, I will be the happiest person in the world, and will start calling myself “the minister who made a difference”.
What are your plans for the weekend? Will you get a chance to relax?
Frankly, there is very little opportunity for me to switch off. My phone beeps nonstop, I need to respond to incessant demands and I run around constantly. Being in politics during these Covid times has been testing, but makes you appreciate your strength. For the past three days, parliament has been in session until midnight, so we are all exhausted. I rarely get time to myself, and when I do, I use it to do some deep work.
Regrettably, my husband, parents and children are hundreds of kilometres away from me as the pandemic has locked us in separate zones. I have not had a chance to talk to them for a whole week. Today is a public holiday; I have enjoyed a rare lie-in until 9.30am and I am going to take today off and rest. The way I prefer to refuel is by hiking in the mountains with a friend, or sitting down with a glass of wine to enjoy watching a TV series. I will let you in on my guilty pleasure: at the moment I am addicted the South African spin-off of the reality TV show called “The Real Housewives of…” It follows larger than life and assertive businesswomen… and I can (somewhat!) relate to them…
Reading Time: 10 minutes
Chair of Sichuan Huashui Excellence & Huashui (taxation firms)
Sun Ping is adamant that setting oneself a strict framework of rules is the key to a successful career and a harmonious life. She has been moulded by a rigorous military-style education (both figuratively and literally – her father was an army officer). It included a rather unique time management protocol that she has adopted ever since and implemented with her collaborators and family members. Loyalty to her parents is an important rule of hers: although she had a strong desire to become a teacher, she followed the route they had set out for her and became an accountant. She ended up embracing a successful career in taxation. Diligence is another core principle of her framework. A self-made woman, she started her professional life as a cashier, working her way up before launching her own taxation consultancy firm in 2004. She has accumulated over 30 years of experience in financial management, solving tax-related disputes, and pre-IPO financial and tax consulting.
She is now one of the most respected and recognised professionals in her field in China. She is driven by solid work and moral ethics that have, at times, led her to stand up to senior colleagues, even at the risk of losing her job. Strong minded, she wakes up at 6:50am 365 days of the year without needing an alarm clock, and goes for a 5K run “even during the Chinese New Year festival”. She is openly ambitious and aims one day to compete with the likes of KPMG and EY, but humbly accepts that she won’t succeed without a lifelong learning plan. This is what led her to join the Sino-French SWUFE-Audencia DBA programme, from which she was the only woman to graduate in 2018. Keen to convey the importance of hard work and resilience to the young generation, she volunteers as a Student Career Development Mentor at SWUFE and Chengdu universities.
But she is quick to point out that she doesn’t advocate setting up and following rules for the sake of it. Her structured organisation is what allows her to optimise her agenda and prioritise quality time with her husband and son, as well as some alone time for her to recharge. Every inch a romantic, France had been in her mind for years as she fantasised about the prospect of strolling along the Seine holding her loved-one in one hand, and a bunch of roses in the other. And she is keen to put an end to the stereotype of the dull accountant: she too can let her hair down at times … albeit decently and moderately!
Thank you very much for accepting the invitation. What should I call you?
My name is Sun Ping. My surname Sun is a reference to Sun Yat-sen, and my first name Ping means “apple” in Chinese. But my French teachers all called me Sunny so this is how you could address me.
Let’s start at the beginning Sunny, how would you describe your childhood?
I was raised in Chengdu, in the Sichuan province of China, also called “Heaven on Earth” for the beauty and abundance of the land. My father was an army officer who fought in the Korean war against the US. My mother is a medical doctor, as were her father and grandfather. Our home was a bit like an army barracks and my father raised my sister and I like his soldiers. He devised a schedule in which every single task – even the most mundane, had a time allocation that I had to respect. Each morning I awoke to the sound of his loud whistling. I then had 3 minutes to make my bed, and fold sheets, pillows and quilts the way soldiers do. I then had exactly 3 minutes to brush my teeth and wash my face, one minute to tie my shoes, and one minute to put on my red scarf.
I can understand why such a strict routine could sound a bit extreme, but I always complied obediently without any sense of restriction or resentment against my parents. I received a strict education, but I was loved. This stringent time management system had a very profound impact on me, and I naturally integrated it into my school life and the way I ran my business and my family life. I am grateful to my parents for empowering me with techniques that have actually given me the freedom to live a richer and freer life.
When you were a child, what did you want to do when you grew up?
From a young age, I wanted to become a teacher. I have so much respect for this noble profession. I see teachers as “engineers of the human mind”, who have the power to pass on knowledge and to purify the soul.
If you had such a strongly anchored dream, how did you end up following a very different path in the taxation industry?
My mother made education choices for me based on careful considerations. She envisaged a career in medicine, law or accountancy which she thought were the most respected in the West. She thought it was important to pick a profession that none of our family members had had before. And one that would suit my strong-minded and independent personality. This is how the idea for me to become an accountant emerged. It turned out to be an excellent choice for me, offering me a liberal but respectable status.
You have climbed the ladder up to a very senior position. Have you benefited from the connections of some of your friends or relatives?
Not at all. I started studying accounting in 1985, and after I graduated from university, I got an internship as a cashier. I then worked my way up to become an accountant, then to the head of the accounting section, and further on up to executive positions. The director of the first company I worked at – a new technology research institute, certainly helped me in this ascent by trusting me to make my own decisions, which boosted my confidence.
Can you share some of the boldest moves that you have made in your career?
In 2003, I felt the need to be challenged further so I joined a non-Chinese company. Foreign businesses in mainland China had higher standards and requirements for talents at that time. At one point, differences with the VP of our US-based company came to a head when I discovered that he had been involved in some malpractice. My job made me directly accountable to the Board of Directors, and my professional ethics were telling me to report him. Before I did so, I reached out to him privately to confront him. When it became clear that he would not resign, I decided to leave because there was no way that I could work with someone dishonest.
The same year, I made another bold decision by setting up Sichuan Jinlitong Financial Consulting Co Ltd, a financial consulting company. My husband is a financial expert, which helped me gain expertise in science, tech and real estate loans, as well as the bank conditions and risk preferences. At the end of the year, I had signed contracts with a large number of state-owned companies, such as the giant, Chengdu Telecom, as well as real estate development companies. Soon after, in August 2004, upon recommendation from one of my clients, I set up my own tax firm.
The way I went about setting this second company was equally bold… At that time, the Chinese government was in the process of reforming tax firms throughout the country, and they had not authorised the registration of any new tax practitioners for the past two years. I was aware of this legal challenge, but I was motivated by the pressing needs of my clients. So I decided to go straight to the secretary general of the tax administration centre. I told her that unlike many other applicants, I already had a long list of clients ready to be served, and asked her to trust me to develop my business in an exceptional manner. My appeal was successful and my papers were processed in a month: a record!
I noticed on your CV that in 2000 you did an MBA at Sichuan University, in 2010 an EMBA programme at SWUFE (Southwest University of Finance & Economics), and then in 2015 a DBA with Audencia in Chengdu. Where does this thirst for further education come from?
People often perceive me as a tough female CEO, a sort of business shark, but I think of myself as an ordinary woman on a perpetual quest for knowledge. In 2010, after I launched my own venture, I felt that it had been too long since I obtained my MBA. I had to keep my knowledge up to date in order to meet the ever-evolving needs of my clients.
What were your reasons for choosing this DBA and what are your most important take homes?
What impressed me the most was the international outlook of the programme. In the years to come, I want to make my company the most international of the domestic tax firms. I plan to take advantage of the Hainan Free Trade Port to take my firm from the Sichuan province to the international stage. My goal is to build up my scale and reputation and one day compete with the Big Four (KPMG, E&Y, PwC, & DTT). I have to confess being a liberal and romantic person at heart, so France had always been a bit of a fantasy for me, and I had been to France several times during my youth. The prospect of being taught by French professors (in tandem with Chinese professors), and to come to France (Nantes) for a 2-week learning trip definitely helped sway my decision!
I graduated four years ago, and I can tell that the programme has opened my mind to what matters most in order to succeed as an entrepreneur. I learnt that focusing on sales performance is not enough and how critical it is to integrate management into the entrepreneurial process. I have also become more caring towards my staff and adopted some small rituals like noting down their birthdays. My critical analysis and problem-solving abilities have also improved.
Are you still close to your DBA classmates?
Very much so. We were a small group and only five of us graduated in 2018. Studying so intensely together over three whole years created some strong friendships. Professionally I help them out with taxation queries and have even taken some as clients.
Do you feel that you have encountered additional challenges because of your gender?
I honestly don’t think so. I have been able to do everything that men in my field do … except maybe drinking and smoking, … this is just not part of my lifestyle (laugh)! And I am proud that a large majority of my employees are women.
Do you ever regret not having achieved your childhood dream of becoming a teacher?
I have no regrets because my aspirations have changed, and I feel fulfilled by my job. I create value for my clients through my professionalism and dedication to solving their financial problems which gives me pride and satisfaction. And actually, I can find similarities between my work and being a teacher. When I give a lecture on taxation, an interpretation of taxation policies and guidance to taxation solutions, I am sharing and passing on knowledge. Besides, I dedicate a lot of energy to projects that support the younger generation. I volunteer as a mentor in several universities and have set up a scholarship programme in partnership with both SWUFE and Hainan Normal University to open up opportunities for deserving students.
Do you have any words of advice to share with the students and alumni from Audencia and SWUFE?
I would urge them not compare themselves to others, because this is detrimental to their emotional wellbeing. Secondly, it pays to be diligent. I get the impression that the new generation of students lack grit, they give up too soon and tend to grumble, blaming any failure on their parents who are never rich or powerful enough. Thirdly, keep learning. Surround yourself with interesting people and insightful books. “The Way of Life” by Kazuo Inamori had a profound impact on me. He is a globally renowned entrepreneur who became a monk at the age of sixty-eight and advocated altruism in the business world.
What adjectives do you think your colleagues would use to describe you?
I actually surveyed them ahead of this interview! (laugh). This is mainly what they came up with: self-disciplined, smart in her thinking and in her appearance, well educated, strong on emotional intelligence.
Strict time keeping is a principle that you have maintained throughout your life. Does that make it difficult for some of your colleagues to adapt to your standards?
Initially it must have been hard for some partners and subordinates to adapt to my system, but after communication and guidance from me, they are more or less used to it and working together is a smooth and pleasant experience.
How are you bringing up your son; which principles have you kept from your parents and which new ones have you adopted?
I have definitely passed on time management and a set of ground rules to my son. I am proud that from an early age he has understood the concept of respect. I advocate setting up rules and enforcing them democratically, as a way of avoiding arguments. I often say to him that home is a place for love not arguments. This is my recipe for harmonious family relationships. Since my son was three years old, we have held weekly family discussions and this certainly helps to minimise conflicts.
However, I have also adopted modern educational principles. He has had more choices than I did, such as which language to learn, which country to study in or which industry to start his career in.
Has your son chosen a different trajectory to yours?
In fact, he has also gone into entrepreneurship. He graduated from New York University, and when a Free Trade Port was established in Hainan, he felt the urge to contribute to the island’s development and make a success of himself. He started his own business in the main city, Haikou. My son is my biggest pride. If I have achieved anything so far, it is that I have raised an emotionally intelligent son.
Do you manage to block off time in your schedule for leisure activities?
The beauty of following a strictly structured schedule is that it allows me to dedicate quality time to my loved ones. I also try not to forget my own wellbeing. My hobbies range from going to the spa, sharing an afternoon tea with my girlfriends, tailoring clothes, hiking, singing, attending book clubs, flower arranging…
The variety of interests shows another interesting side of your personality…
Many people think that all accountants are dull. It’s true that I do have a serious and disciplined side, but I have also retained a childlike sense of humour and am a fun person to be around. I enjoy joining in team building activities even though I always make sure I’m acting appropriately. And you should see me ahead of the Chinese New Year festivities… each year I get embarrassingly excited about cooking, decorating the house and arranging flowers. Just like a little girl!
Reading Time: 9 minutes
Professional rugby player
Fulgence Ouedraogo is the tireless tackler and captain of the iconic Montpellier Hérault Rugby Club, in the South West of France. Loyal to the club where he started as a pro, “Fufu” has been described as a role model and the soul of Montpellier. In 2011, he led his team to the final of the Top 14, the French professional rugby union club competition… gritting his teeth to ignore the pain of a broken hand. His international record is equally impressive. He has participated in several Six Nations tournaments (in 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2013), won the Under 21 World Cup Championship, and faced the mighty All Blacks in the World Cup final in 2011.
With a height of 1m88 (6’2”) and weighing 99kg (15.5 stone), this gentle giant is highly respected for his integrity and bravery. Learning about his challenging start in life sheds some light onto his special qualities. Born in Burkina Faso, his parents sent him on his own to France when he was three, to be raised by a foster family. They hoped that this upbringing would give him access to a better education. Against all odds, Fulgence has pursued an exceptional sporting journey and he is grateful for how fulfilling his life has turned out to be. But he is still battling with unanswered questions around the merits of his parents’ decision. The athlete refers to rugby as a school of life that has helped him to take control of his destiny equipping him with crucial skills on and off the field. In 2017, in anticipation of his post-sporting career, Fulgence enrolled on an executive education programme at Audencia that he successfully combined with his intensive training regime.
Fulgence shares with us his efforts to make peace with a troublesome past, his passion for the noble sports, and a few of his favourite pleasures as a father raising young children in the countryside.
Do you remember the day that your parents sent you away?
My earliest memories start when I was 4 or 5 so I have no recollection of the separation. After my older sister died, my parents decided to send me to France; they wanted to offer me the best possible chances of a good education. In their mind, I would return to Burkina Faso after my studies. But my life has taken a different turn from the one they had predicted. My father, a primary school teacher, was in touch with a colleague in France who facilitated my transfer to a host family.
I have read that the initials of your mother, brother and sister are tattooed on your shoulder. Is this a sign of forgiveness?
To this day, I still have so many unanswered questions such as why I was the only sibling that my parents sent away. The lack of answers troubled me during my childhood and I struggled to find my place and to grow without the comfort of knowing where my family nest was. Especially now that I am a father, and even though I know that my parents had good intentions, their decision is hard to accept.
I had limited connections with my parents, my brother and my sister who all stayed in Burkina. But on reaching adulthood, I made a conscious attempt to discover my roots. Reconnecting with my family members hasn’t been easy because I don’t know them well and we have never shared any intimate moments. Nevertheless, despite all that has happened, I believe that the emotional links between a mother and son are indestructible and I am glad that we were back in touch. My mother passed away in 2015 when I was preparing for the World Cup and the last time I went to Burkina was for her funeral.
There is no doubt that had I stayed in Burkina, I would never have had the same career. But even more now that I am a father, I appreciate how growing up among your relatives gives you solid foundations. Anyway, there is no point in dwelling on life scenarios that I had no control over. However challenging my childhood was, it made me into who I am today.
Tell us about your childhood and how you got into rugby
I was raised in a village near Montpellier, steeped in the traditions of south western France. I only have the colour of my skin from Africa; I don’t speak the language and I haven’t mastered the cultural codes. Rugby wasn’t a traditional sport in my foster family; they had actually planned to sign me up for tennis lessons, but the club didn’t have enough members to open, so rugby was plan B! I started playing at the age of 6 in a small club near our village.
I am quite shy and have always been rather reserved. For me rugby was primarily a way of having fun with my friends and letting off steam. As a child I didn’t even think of becoming a professional rugby player; I wanted to be a fireman, then a lawyer! But from the age of 16-17, my performance improved rapidly. Our coach identified my potential, I moved to the Montpellier Club, and this is when I first started to dream about becoming a pro. Before I turned 19, I was selected to join the French team and soon afterwards, played my first game with the pros in the first team. In under two years, I went from playing in my little local club to representing my country in international competitions, which was quite surreal. I have remained grounded, thanks to my friends who came to cheer me on at the big games.
Years of success ensued. What are some of the most emotional moments you would like to highlight?
It is hard to pick just a few, but I would go with my first game in the first team for France because it felt such a special privilege. Then the whole of 2011 was memorable. I participated in my first Senior Rugby World cup and we played the final against the host country at the legendary Eden Park Stadium in Auckland. After the national anthems, the All Blacks performed their traditional haka and we decided to respond by staring back and advancing towards them in a V-shaped formation. We suffered a narrow defeat but this match is etched in my memory forever.
You were very young when you were entrusted with the captain’s armband. How did you manage this responsibility?
I had been captain of Montpellier’s 1st team but it was a still shock when I heard I had been named captain of France’s U21 team. Many of the players in the team were professionals with more experience than me, and some had played on the international stage. It was daunting at first, but I learnt on the job. My style consists in leading by example rather than through longwinded speeches. I insist on flawless behaviour in training as well as during matches. This is how I earnt my legitimacy.
There is a unique ethos in rugby. What makes you so attached to the game?
From the very outset, I have had the privilege of being trained by exceptional coaches who shared their passion for the sport and its values: discipline, respect, integrity, and solidarity. These values build character and transcend into everyday life. Rugby pitches are often where lifelong friendships are forged. It is well known that I am inseparable from Francois Trinh-Duc with whom I have been lucky to follow a similar progression, from our little club at the Pic Saint-Loup, all the way to the national team. But I still count many other of my childhood teammates as my closest friends. As adults, we have all turned out as well-rounded citizens.
Where does the nickname “Captain Courage” come from?
In 2011, I fractured my metacarpals in the semis of the Top 14. It hurt like hell, but there was no way that I would have missed my club’s final a week later. So I strapped my hand tight and bit the bullet! It was not my most serious injury, but it’s the one that people have most commented on, and the one that earned me that nickname.
How have you managed the most challenging phases of your sporting career?
My shoulder injury in 2013 was worrying. I underwent surgery and I contracted a nosocomial infection in hospital. I had to go back to the O.R. a month later, and returning to the pitch was really tough. Difficult relationships in the club, disappointing personal and team performances affected me mentally. As I am not the type of player who easily opens up, I could only rely on myself. The easy way out would have been to quit but I am a man of passion and challenges motivated to train even harder.
In 2017, you enrolled on an executive education programme at Audencia (DCP*), presumably to prepare your post-rugby years. Is it a programme that you would recommend to other sportspeople?
2017 was a pivotal year on many levels for me. My partner and I moved house, and our son was born in January 2018. Fatherhood changed my priorities, and I felt a stronger sense of responsibility. For the first time, I seriously started to project myself into my post-rugby life. I wanted to be equipped to anticipate my career shift. I signed up to a skills assessment programme and decided to retrain. I found the Audencia programme appealing because its solid curriculum including accounting, HR, negotiation and finance, would give me the keys to a variety of projects. In addition, the remote learning possibility was particularly suited to my heavy and unpredictable training schedule.
*DCP [Director of a Profit Centre] is 9, 12 or 15 month programme, in French, offered by Audencia Executive Education
But going back to school was testing! I was coming home drained after a day’s training. I was often alone with my baby so I had to put him to bed as early as I could to start studying. Most of the students in the programme had some knowledge of management as well as some business experience. For me, this universe was totally unfamiliar. I felt so behind and initially I had to google definitions which seemed straightforward to the others. I resorted to asking my peers for help… that was quite a first for me! Luckily, my classmates were great, understanding, and supportive.
It took a lot of resilience but I am proud to have persevered. The programme gave me the vocabulary, the contacts, the mindset and the confidence to start a business venture. I would recommend this formula to other sportsmen, but I would just warn them that the experience can feel isolating so it requires self-discipline. I only came to the Nantes campus once, for the graduation ceremony. There was a great atmosphere that day. We were all so happy to meet each other -at last- in the flesh, and some students even queued up to ask me to sign autographs!
I started the programme with a few ideas in event management, and I refined one during the year. Then Covid threw a spanner in the works. I am now working on another one that could work via video. More will be revealed later…
What does a typical working day look like for you? And a “down day”?
On a training day, I usually leave home at 7am. We start with some stretching, a warmup, and exercises to test our fitness level. We have breakfast together, and this is followed by a video session, a weight workout, the first training, then lunch, another video session, another training, and the post training video session. We finish off with stretching, physio and balneotherapy. I don’t get home until 6.30pm. So you see, the regime is more intense that many people realise! I like to spend as much of my downtime outside as possible. I was raised in the countryside, I love fishing and tending to my vegetable garden. And spending some quality time with my family, close to nature.
What brings you purpose and meaning in your everyday life?
My children are 2 and 3 and I am concerned about the environment we are going to leave them. Our planet is precious and I try to teach them what can be done at our level to protect it. I am far from a perfect environmentalist, but I focus on sharing with them life’s simplest pleasures. I show them the little gestures that create attachment to the natural world. I want them to understand the importance of respect and compassion. When my kids come back from nursery, the first thing they ask is to get the eggs from the henhouse, to pet the rabbit and to pick raspberries. Nothing makes me happier.
Where do you see yourself in 5 or 10 years?
I am actively reflecting on this. I hope to still have 1 or 2 seasons of rugby ahead of me. When this is over, I might relocate, even maybe abroad to experience another culture, but nothing is set in stone yet. As for deciding on my future professional adventure, I know it will be difficult because when you have lived off our passion all your life, it’s hard to imagine a project that will be as motivating. I doubt I will ever be able to re-live the same intense sensations that I have enjoyed on the playing field. But I will still look for a role that can provide me with emotions and pleasure.
What are the two black and white photos hanging on the wall behind you?
One is a picture of me as young boy having a whale of a time on the pitch with my friends. The other is a portrait of Mohammed Ali in the ring. He is the ultimate embodiment of discipline and mental strength, and an icon to many athletes.